class difference!

[Zechnophobe]

I really agree that the change was fairly needed. Before you had no speciality of the Spirit class. They sorta had a grab bag without any of the best stuff for either.

Now might = best at rage, magic = best at spells, and spirit = best at leadership.

The only problem I see now, is that 'boss' fights where you don't get to use Rage are rather a problem for warriors. They lose out on their biggest perk. I feel like something should have been done to make rage more useful, even if you aren't using your chest. Heck, I'd love it if they could finally find a way to integrate 'rage' abilities into boss fights in a meaningful way.

[Fatt_Shade]

@Loopy About your comment that Creation is great skill and giving spells longer duration. I`m bitching about that for long time. Check intellect description in hero screen : every 20 points of intellect certain spells last longer. This was in the Legend, AP and CW and never worked. So now they make skill that does that, but still no bonus from high intellect. Gj 1C
In HoMM3 babies mod this was fixed i have no idea how, but it`s doable which means if they fix it in game Creation + this stats boost some spells will be super overpowered.
Expl intellect 61 means +3 turn for spells and +2 from Creator and 2 basic from Sheep spell = 7 turn, or fear 9 turns . . .

[Zechnophobe]

Originally Posted by Fatt_Shade

@Loopy About your comment that Creation is great skill and giving spells longer duration. I`m bitching about that for long time. Check intellect description in hero screen : every 20 points of intellect certain spells last longer. This was in the Legend, AP and CW and never worked. So now they make skill that does that, but still no bonus from high intellect. Gj 1C
In HoMM3 babies mod this was fixed i have no idea how, but it`s doable which means if they fix it in game Creation + this stats boost some spells will be super overpowered.
Expl intellect 61 means +3 turn for spells and +2 from Creator and 2 basic from Sheep spell = 7 turn, or fear 9 turns . . .

The 20 intellect thing works on some spells, just not ALL spells. It seems to only effect spells that have variable durations. So Magic spring gets longer, I think haste and stone skin do, but polymorph does not.

It's just another instance of poorly described mechanics only understandable via trial and error .

[DGDobrev]

I tend to disagree that paladins were bad. It was just hard to play them as a third option. Everyone was so obsessed with Warrior and Mage playstyle, that he failed to see how a mix of them could do well. Here's an example of how to play a weird Paladin in KBAP/KBCW:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GDGmNH-8FFY

I do find the Skald to be a bit overpowered. I suppose the warrior took a leadership nerf cause some of the new skills would make him a beast of he had too big of an army. Still, as far as buffs go, the difference between lvl 1 Stoneskin and lvl 3 stoneskin is big, and the Warrior won't be able to see much from it until late game. Having healing as a set spell is just plain awesome - it makes the skald a prime target for a no-loss play, especially if you can get some higher HP units quickly.

We will see how this KB plays out. It may just turn out to have made all the 3 classes interesting.

[BB Shockwave]

Those people who love to go "munchkin" on this game and don't mind using the same army in all their walkthroughs always did, and always will complain that the Paladin sucked...

But he didn't.

He was not an uber powerhouse that could be (ab)used to steamroll everything. So what? I never play these games for a 4-hour gametime walkthrough or such sillyness. I had a lot of fun with my Paladin in both TL and AP/CW. In TL, they provided a nice balance between mage and warrior, letting me use a little of both skill trees (a warrior has trouble mastering magic schools and a mage has trouble with the might tree) - plus some added bonus. Also, leadership. Paladin had a lot of Regalia slots - came in handy to increase my army size. Basically, I got to use all but the most powerful spells and Rage spirit skills, trying out all the aspects of the game on my first walkthrough. It was fun. When I replayed as a Mage, I now knew what spells I want to focus on.

In AP, the Paladin got easy access to some great skills like the inititative/speed-raising random Adrenaline, good Rage and spell abilities, plus Resurrection after battle which is just great. Not to mention her class-specific medals that boost Paladins and Inquisitors a LOT.

WotN changed things, but it's unfair to say the larger army means the Paladin will be overpowered now. Unless you are doing Impossible and have calculated everything with minute detail, you will not notice much of a difference. The Warrior will still have an easier time mastering army-boosting Might skills and rage skills, the Mage will still have easier access to the (now 4!) magic schools. It's still balanced.

[jake21]

In the previous two games I found paladin better than mages at the end game (but still far behind warrior; warrior; esp in crossworld with insane better special skill was simply easy as cake). At the start of the games I found mage did pretty good because they started off with decent spell that was better than low troup count (early game is like level 1-5; late games is level > 20).

I haven't fully played WOTN yet; but my initial impression is that skalad is significantly easier both at start and end of game; mage weaken from previous games at the start due to weaker spell (my sooth had a bit of time up to level 17; but after I fed my first valk lots of items (which gave me lots of rage) things were a lot easier; though i was no were close to no loss).
-
My summary would be that they went a bit overboard in improving skalad (paladin) and debuffing warriors; though warriors are not bad - mages are always a bit more of a challenge.

(these comments are on impossible). Note that I find no-loss impossible in crossworld not too difficutl but can sometime take a bit of time; while impoisslbe is not too bad in legend; I was never really able to get no-loss impossible in legend (I think better players have done this). For WOTN no-loss is going to be difficult due to start of game but skalad should be feasible; other two classes I have my doubts.

[BB Shockwave]

Warriors will never be as effective at spellcasting as mages - due to lacking mana and int. plus slots to equip items that boost these stats, and lack of runes to update all spell schools to level 3 (they can, but would need to sacrifice a lot of runes for that). A Mage will always have a bigger spell selection and mana pool.

The paladin was - and always will be -somewhere inbetween, which was just fine. While a warrior will mostly cast mana-cheap debuffs and buffs, a paladin can use more costly summons, resurrections, time back. He will still not be able to cast such damaging spells as a mage, or cast twice per round.

[Fatt_Shade]

Am I seeing right here ? In might skill tree Viking specific skills are Persistance (total crap and really similar to Shield of rage) and Absolute rage ??? So any class can get Bloodlust and Runic power, how is Rage domain of Warrior class if any can get this 2 mostly rage oriented skills ???
Mage is best in magic and spell dmg, Paladin have greatest army and dmg undead/demons, Warrior have best rage skills NO wait he doesnt

[Loopy]

Bloodlust and Berserker (req for Bloodlust) cost a metric ton of might runes. And if you want to be a true master of rage you need the other rage abilities, which will improve damage by up to 60%, give you a 60% chance to use rage twice a turn, and give you a ton of rage. Those happen to be on the opposite end of the tree. Other classes aren't going to have a chance at filling the entire tree in, so they will need to decide between starting with rage or gaining and using it much more efficiently. And TBH I think Bloodlust is pretty bad in comparison, chugging a rage potion is just as good and the other end of the tree has some awesome things.

In the end I would much prefer no unique skills at all, letting rune availability determine what you can get. The first unique skill of each tree is pretty meh except Edda vs undead, and the second unique would be damn hard to reach even if it was available.

[BB Shockwave]

Yes, this is really odd that the skill that lets you use Rage abilities twice per turn is... not warrior specific. With that logic, Higher Magic should be available to everyone, not just mages.