I-153: cheap or not?

[IamKFAM]

I think you may be compensating.

[dkwookie]

I remember when I used the 153 I was getting 20 odd kills easy. One match I got 31, after which I decided to never use it again.
The problem with it is it requires so little skill to keep on an oponent. I also found the cannon fire strange. After a couple of kills the cannons appear to bug and get a sweet spot kill nearly every turn. It seemed so much like a bug that I fealt bad shooting people down with it.
As for dealing with it, yeah it's pretty straightforward but it knocks the fun out of a match

[Shadowcorp]

wookie has it down to a tee with his post, the 153 is just too easy: which is why people call it a noob plane, nobodys calling their pilots noobs. It just makes me sad to see quality pilots waste their time and play in a completley inflexible manor.

[Soviet Ace]

*Cheering and cries of joy begin, as Soviet Ace steps into the thread to give his two cents*

I can see what your all saying, that the I-153 has an advantage over turning with other planes, but what you have to understand. Is that ANY mono-plane, that would try and turn with a bi-plane would fail miserably in a turning fight. The reason why, is because the bi-plane is slower and since it's slower can turn faster. If they had put a Italian Fiat CR42, into the game or even a British Gloster Gladiator; then the I-153 would have less of an advantage since both of those planes are bi-planes, and can equally turn with an I-153 depending on the situation and place.

Now for the game, the I-153 is not cheating or cheap in anyway. I agree, that a lot of noobs fly it; which should be actually the complete opposite. Most noobs should be getting shot down and ruined because the I-153 and I-16 were both unstable at times, and many new pilots flying them died. It was the veterans and pro's who flew; which accomplished the scores that many of them had.

Anyway, we all know that the Russian planes (all of them) seem to have an advantage, over all the other planes in the game. So there's really no point in complaining about whether the I-153 is cheating or cheap because it's just how they modeled it.

It really doesn't matter, if the I-153 Chaika or the other two bi-planes I mentioned before have an advantage over the other planes; which in real life they would have because any bi-plane can out turn a mono-plane. The point is, if your flying an I-153 or someone else is flying it. Just BnZ the damn thing. It may not be as fun, but it is YOUR (and their) fault for trying to turn and get into it's turning radius. Don't blame the plane, just because you've been smart or dumb enough to take advantage of 1-2 tactics, the I-153 has over all the others. (The second advantage, would be rolling )

[InfiniteStates]

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace

*Cheering and cries of joy begin, as Soviet Ace steps into the thread to give his two cents*

Errr...yes. OK.

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace

...but what you have to understand. Is that ANY mono-plane, that would try and turn with a bi-plane would fail miserably in a turning fight. The reason why, is because the bi-plane is slower and since it's slower can turn faster.

It turns faster because it has 2 sets of wings (hence the name bi[nary]-plane) which gives it (almost) double lift. So when it puts it's wingtip to Earth all that lift converts to turning ability.

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace

It really doesn't matter, if the I-153 Chaika or the other two bi-planes I mentioned before have an advantage over the other planes; which in real life they would have because any bi-plane can out turn a mono-plane. The point is, if your flying an I-153 or someone else is flying it. Just BnZ the damn thing. It may not be as fun, but it is YOUR (and their) fault for trying to turn and get into it's turning radius. Don't blame the plane, just because you've been smart or dumb enough to take advantage of 1-2 tactics, the I-153 has over all the others. (The second advantage, would be rolling )

You're missing the point - we all know how to defeat it. But it's boring. And it's rare that the majority of players will adopt an anti-153 style and will instead ignore it and go about their turning fights. Which means the 153 just picks people off. Hence, cheap.

[Soviet Ace]

Originally Posted by InfiniteStates

Errr...yes. OK.


It turns faster because it has 2 sets of wings (hence the name bi[nary]-plane) which gives it (almost) double lift. So when it puts it's wingtip to Earth all that lift converts to turning ability.


You're missing the point - we all know how to defeat it. But it's boring. And it's rare that the majority of players will adopt an anti-153 style and will instead ignore it and go about their turning fights. Which means the 153 just picks people off. Hence, cheap.

Yes, I know having two sets of wings, also gives it a better advantage as well, but speed is not everything. So actually, if you tried turning an I-153 Chaika with an old WW1 Fokker DVII or maybe even a Sopwith of some kind, the Fokker or Sopwith would outturn the Chaika because it's speed and radius of turn.

And I think your problem isn't exactly with the I-153, but how to deal with it. I know BnZ isn't fun, and that's why I stick with either the Yak's, La's, Polikarpov's, and other low altitude planes. Because TnB is what I like best.

And like I already said, it's not your fault or their's if your or them are flying the I-153, and get so many kills because your enemy isn't smart enough to realize that the I-153 has a HUGE advantage in turning. And once again, if your dumb enough to try and turn with a I-153 (Sim or Realistic) then you deserve to be shot down because you tried turning with it, and knew the outcome would be fatal for you.

If you really don't like dealing with the I-153, then just do some BnZ passes; or just completely IGNORE it entirely. The player flying it, will probably just give up trying to chase after once he realizes he cant. It's not hard to understand, that if your not flying the I-153 Chaika, you have every advantage except roll and turning. If Erick Hartmann can get 352 kills, using BnZ; then I'm sure it wasn't that boring. And if it is boring for you, then just go after the other planes. Common sense is something important when flying.

Remember, "Beware of the Hun in the Sun."

[InfiniteStates]

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace

Yes, I know having two sets of wings, also gives it a better advantage as well, but speed is not everything. So actually, if you tried turning an I-153 Chaika with an old WW1 Fokker DVII or maybe even a Sopwith of some kind, the Fokker or Sopwith would outturn the Chaika because it's speed and radius of turn.

I didn't say anything about speed, I said lift. The two things are not the same, although one is a function of the other. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you understand the physics of a wing, but your paragraph makes me think maybe not.

And I don't care about how it compares to other real world bi-planes. We're talking about the game, and specifically online battles.

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace

And I think your problem isn't exactly with the I-153, but how to deal with it. I know BnZ isn't fun, and that's why I stick with either the Yak's, La's, Polikarpov's, and other low altitude planes. Because TnB is what I like best.

Then you think wrong. As I've stated, dealing with them is a no-brainer. But all the counter-arguments in this thread seem to assume a one on one battle. That is no problem - I will eat them up and spit out the tail fin. My issue is with a big online dogfight, where the majority of people are in spits, 109s or whatever, and one or two guys will exploit the cheapness of the 153 (in this situation) to rack up kills.

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace

And like I already said, it's not your fault or their's if your or them are flying the I-153, and get so many kills because your enemy isn't smart enough to realize that the I-153 has a HUGE advantage in turning. And once again, if your dumb enough to try and turn with a I-153 (Sim or Realistic) then you deserve to be shot down because you tried turning with it, and knew the outcome would be fatal for you.

Well, 153 pilots don't have the plane forced on them, so of course it's their fault they're flying one. And they fly one because they know they can get a lot of cheap kills, exactly because the majority of players will not implement counter-153 tactics and will instead just go about their usual turning battles.

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace

If you really don't like dealing with the I-153, then just do some BnZ passes; or just completely IGNORE it entirely. The player flying it, will probably just give up trying to chase after once he realizes he cant. It's not hard to understand, that if your not flying the I-153 Chaika, you have every advantage except roll and turning. If Erick Hartmann can get 352 kills, using BnZ; then I'm sure it wasn't that boring. And if it is boring for you, then just go after the other planes. Common sense is something important when flying.

Remember, "Beware of the Hun in the Sun."

I do ignore them for the most part and that is when they are a nuisance. The roll and turning advantage are exactly what makes them so cheap because of the nature of online battles.

I think the problem is you are coming at this from a real world view point, and I am coming at it purely from the view point of the game. Unless Erick Hartmann plays on a console with a controller, I don't care about him.

And please stop being so patronising.

[dkwookie]

Originally Posted by InfiniteStates

You're missing the point - we all know how to defeat it. But it's boring. And it's rare that the majority of players will adopt an anti-153 style and will instead ignore it and go about their turning fights. Which means the 153 just picks people off. Hence, cheap.

Bingo, that's exactly it. You get one on your tail in team battle, shoot up to altitude and get set to dive on it, all the while you see "john doe killed joe bloggs" at the bottom of the screen as the 153 player picks off your team. You get back into the fight, get a few shots at him before he realizes you are behind him again. He gets on your tail....repeat ad nauseum

[kozzm0]

Of course you can bnz a biplane and an I-16 too... that's why they had to be replaced with faster planes.

The issue is that in DOGFIGHT mode, they end up with an unfair advantage, because

) it takes longer for bnz kills to add up than kills for whoever happens to be behind the i-153 behind its target.

) the polikarpov's don't blow up very often, they get winged and then they crash for no credit.

I just finished a match against an I-16 that crashed 6 times, then got credit for a kill for crashing into me, and won the match. It didn't hit me with one gunshot, and I died only the one time it crashed into me. It's hard to get credit for killing those things.

[Ghillied raptor]

Originally Posted by InfiniteStates

Errr...yes. OK.


It turns faster because it has 2 sets of wings (hence the name bi[nary]-plane) which gives it (almost) double lift. So when it puts it's wingtip to Earth all that lift converts to turning ability.


You're missing the point - we all know how to defeat it. But it's boring. And it's rare that the majority of players will adopt an anti-153 style and will instead ignore it and go about their turning fights. Which means the 153 just picks people off. Hence, cheap.

BNZ tactics aren't all that bad, it doesn't take very long to disengage and gain some altitude before re-engaging.I'm not so sure about you guys but I get a kick from doing this- I can spend 20-ish minutes stalking a single enemy and not get bored.I find entering a turning battle is very boring and often deadly(for me),I usually leave the fight with more holes than swiss cheese.