4-12 wish list (Merged)

[fruitbat]

A quick question, is wind modelled on bombs as they fall?

[Malkav]

Originally Posted by fruitbat

A quick question, is wind modelled on bombs as they fall?

Yep

[iMattheush]

I think good request is:
- adding earlier versions of some aircrafts (Bf-109D-1, E-1, Bf-110B-1, C-1) which fights in the early stage of war, and some new planes, e.g.:
Polish
-PZL.37 'Los'
-PZL.23 'Karas'
French
-Dewoitine D.520
-Bloch MB.152
British
-Fairey Battle

I hope this is interesting request for us. You're doing great work, Team Daidalos!

[Pursuivant]

Originally Posted by fruitbat

this particular point is not true, however, i agree that there are many things that could be done to improve flying bombers in the game, a height tool in the fmb for briefings would be particularly useful imo.

My bad for missing the wind height and speed option in the FMB. Let's hope that it allows for even more dynamic weather effects later on.

[Pursuivant]

Originally Posted by ECV56_Guevara

Here an example of the multiple target marking systems/navigation aids used by the Bomber command.

That's a nice link!

Looking at it, it seems that it wouldn't be that hard to model the various Pathfinder techniques.

1) H2S - Just create a modified view of the regular map, so that it looks sort of like this:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...ay_Cologne.jpg

All you need to do is treat water as black areas, land as dark gray and buildings and bridges (or just city plates) as speckled and streaked white.

This view wouldn't be much different from "radar" map views produced as mods.

And, of course, you have a signal emitted from the plane when it has H2S turned on, which allows it to be tracked by German nightfighters carrying NAXOS.

2) OBOE - This is very similar to existing navigation aids in the game and would be very easy to implement. You have two signal beacons - one from the CAT station and the other from the MOUSE station. As long as the game detects that the plane is flying at the correct distance from CAT it sends one tone. Too far away and it sends another tone, too close and it sends still another tone.

When the plane gets near its target, the game sends the MOUSE warning signal as long as the plane is on the correct course indicated by CAT. The game then has the plane release its markers according to the signal sent from MOUSE.

3) PARRAMATTA - This is nothing more than Mosquitos or other bombers loaded with marker flares, so it's just a loadout option. It's easy to implement, since flares can be modeled in the game. Just get the right colors of yellow, red, blue, etc.

Operations with follow-up Pathfinders re-marking the target can be created using the FMB.

4) NEWHAVEN - This is just another use of the parachute flares loadout. The FMB can be used to create the full effect, with the lead aircraft dropping parachute flares and follow-on aircraft dropping marker flares.

5) WANGANUI - This is basically the same as NEWHAVEN, except that the parachute flares are dropped from a higher altitude and more of them are dropped.

To get the whole night bomber effect, you'd also want:

A) Clouds, smoke and haze as placeable objects. This simulates smokescreens, smoke from fires or the ubiquitous haze which blanketed most 1940s era cities. All are useful visual navigation aids and countermeasures against precision bombing.

B) Large, high fires as placeable objects. This simulates the massive fires caused by incendiary bombing. It would be even more impressive if you could get turbulence effects above really big fires, simulating the effects of the rising heat column on air density and firestorm effects. This was a potential hazard for low-flying incendiary bombers - particularly the B-29s operating over Japan.

C) Rework existing fires so that they last longer. Realistically, even a small house fire can burn for hours and the rubble can remain hot for days.

D) A rework of static objects to indicate whether they're flammable or non-flammable. Flammable objects continue to burn if they get hit by an incendiary, otherwise, the fire goes out.

E) The possibility of flames spreading to nearby flammable objects.

F) The option of having city lights on. Later in the war, the Germans realized that it did little good to black out their cities due to accurate Allied bombing radar and other path-finding measures. So, they just turned the lights back on, since it made it easier for their own nightfighters to navigate and to see enemy aircraft. It also helped flak crews to see British planes due to their shiny black lower surfaces.

Something for our friends at TD to keep in mind for patch 4.12 +n!

[T}{OR]

Originally Posted by fruitbat

... a height tool in the fmb for briefings would be particularly useful imo.

Seconded.

[SPAD-1949]

Originally Posted by Pursuivant

To get the whole night bomber effect, you'd also want:

A) Clouds, smoke and haze as placeable objects. This simulates smokescreens, smoke from fires or the ubiquitous haze which blanketed most 1940s era cities. All are useful visual navigation aids and countermeasures against precision bombing.

Jes I think this is one big gap in this sim.
I'd like to see also Smoke Type 8 and 9, first a large stripe of Smoke eventually combinde with points of fire and the second for a larger area, like a whole village or a perimeter choice parameter setting tab for a whole city covered in smoke.
This should be influenced by the set wind (neglect gust and turbulences )
I just tested it again, when I set wind to 15ms all types of smoke still go straight upwards. Looks odd.
Also the range of visibility of existing and smoke types needs a little adjustment.
I think 200 - 600 m is not enough for the yet existing.
Especially the denser types need at least 10km, the new objects according to over all visibility like morning fog or rain, 30km with clear weather.

B) Large, high fires as placeable objects. This simulates the massive fires caused by incendiary bombing. It would be even more impressive if you could get turbulence effects above really big fires, simulating the effects of the rising heat column on air density and firestorm effects. This was a potential hazard for low-flying incendiary bombers - particularly the B-29s operating over Japan.

+1 Could lead one plane in the prop wash of an other and cause collisions.

C) Rework existing fires so that they last longer. Realistically, even a small house fire can burn for hours and the rubble can remain hot for days.

D) A rework of static objects to indicate whether they're flammable or non-flammable. Flammable objects continue to burn if they get hit by an incendiary, otherwise, the fire goes out.

Especially hit vehicles (not only for bombing missions) should burn long with a dense black smoke.

E) The possibility of flames spreading to nearby flammable objects.

F) The option of having city lights on. Later in the war, the Germans realized that it did little good to black out their cities due to accurate Allied bombing radar and other path-finding measures. So, they just turned the lights back on, since it made it easier for their own nightfighters to navigate and to see enemy aircraft. It also helped flak crews to see British planes due to their shiny black lower surfaces.

Something for our friends at TD to keep in mind for patch 4.12 +n!

Pursuivant, I follow

[JonathanRL]

Fokker D.XXI & P-36 Hawk Campaigns for the Finnish Dynamic Campaign would be utterly awesome.

[ECV56_Guevara]

Originally Posted by Pursuivant

That's a nice link!

Looking at it, it seems that it wouldn't be that hard to model the various Pathfinder techniques.

1) H2S - Just create a modified view of the regular map, so that it looks sort of like this:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...ay_Cologne.jpg

All you need to do is treat water as black areas, land as dark gray and buildings and bridges (or just city plates) as speckled and streaked white.

This view wouldn't be much different from "radar" map views produced as mods.

And, of course, you have a signal emitted from the plane when it has H2S turned on, which allows it to be tracked by German nightfighters carrying NAXOS.

2) OBOE - This is very similar to existing navigation aids in the game and would be very easy to implement. You have two signal beacons - one from the CAT station and the other from the MOUSE station. As long as the game detects that the plane is flying at the correct distance from CAT it sends one tone. Too far away and it sends another tone, too close and it sends still another tone.

When the plane gets near its target, the game sends the MOUSE warning signal as long as the plane is on the correct course indicated by CAT. The game then has the plane release its markers according to the signal sent from MOUSE.

3) PARRAMATTA - This is nothing more than Mosquitos or other bombers loaded with marker flares, so it's just a loadout option. It's easy to implement, since flares can be modeled in the game. Just get the right colors of yellow, red, blue, etc.

Operations with follow-up Pathfinders re-marking the target can be created using the FMB.

4) NEWHAVEN - This is just another use of the parachute flares loadout. The FMB can be used to create the full effect, with the lead aircraft dropping parachute flares and follow-on aircraft dropping marker flares.

5) WANGANUI - This is basically the same as NEWHAVEN, except that the parachute flares are dropped from a higher altitude and more of them are dropped.

agree, great ideas Pursuivant!!!
I guess that presition in nigth bombing, was very poor. I imagine myself trying to hit accurately a target in night enviroment ( a realistic one) and it seems very dificult to achieve in this conditions, if the target wouldn t be a big area. so, we need a big target object, that could resist some impacts. IIRC HFSX has something like it.
By the way could you post a link to mods that reproduce radar please?

Originally Posted by Pursuivant

To get the whole night bomber effect, you'd also want:

A) Clouds, smoke and haze as placeable objects. This simulates smokescreens, smoke from fires or the ubiquitous haze which blanketed most 1940s era cities. All are useful visual navigation aids and countermeasures against precision bombing.

B) Large, high fires as placeable objects. This simulates the massive fires caused by incendiary bombing. It would be even more impressive if you could get turbulence effects above really big fires, simulating the effects of the rising heat column on air density and firestorm effects. This was a potential hazard for low-flying incendiary bombers - particularly the B-29s operating over Japan.

C) Rework existing fires so that they last longer. Realistically, even a small house fire can burn for hours and the rubble can remain hot for days.

D) A rework of static objects to indicate whether they're flammable or non-flammable. Flammable objects continue to burn if they get hit by an incendiary, otherwise, the fire goes out.

E) The possibility of flames spreading to nearby flammable objects.

F) The option of having city lights on. Later in the war, the Germans realized that it did little good to black out their cities due to accurate Allied bombing radar and other path-finding measures. So, they just turned the lights back on, since it made it easier for their own nightfighters to navigate and to see enemy aircraft. It also helped flak crews to see British planes due to their shiny black lower surfaces.

Something for our friends at TD to keep in mind for patch 4.12 +n!

There are some nice sugestion here, but I think that almost all are FPS killers, and DT is very carefull with this parameter.

[Pursuivant]

Originally Posted by ECV56_Guevara

By the way could you post a link to mods that reproduce radar please?

I don't have an exact link, but searching on Special Aircraft Service or IL2 Free Modding ought to give good results. It was one of the first map view mods, so it's probably an easy effect to create.

Originally Posted by ECV56_Guevara

There are some nice sugestion here, but I think that almost all are FPS killers, and DT is very carefull with this parameter.

Agreed that big fires and lots of lights might be FPS killers - especially if they all generate light and shadow effects. Placeable haze, smoke or clouds shouldn't be any more of a frame rate killer than ordinary clouds - as long as they're static effects. Dynamic clouds or smoke could be a problem.

I wonder if it might not be possible to automatically place haze over cities in certain weather conditions as part of the city plate or cloud mapping.

Long-lasting, spreading fires would be the biggest FPS killer. You'd have to make them very simple in appearance, with no actual sprites, to keep them from killing the game. At long distances, it would make a lot of sense to just make a big fire a 2-dimensional "sheet" which alternates between two different levels of transparency or two different color patterns to get the flickering effect. Like at 2:37 here: