BF109 - Can't we just have the gunsight in the middle?

[Lixma]

Originally Posted by SYN_Bliss

Lixma,

We don't use 2 eyes in this sim. We are playing in a 2d world here. We have one POV to look upon and until technology has changed, this is what the limits of COD will be.

So you are basically a cyclops in the game, but my point in all of this is the point of reference you are looking at "in-game" would be one eye, directly in the center of the pit.

Bliss, with respect....you are repeating everything i've tried to explain throughout the thread. Just do a search for 'Cyclops'. I even made this for example....



I must ask you to have a read through my previous posts, i've been there and got the T-shirt.

The last thing I would want to see on my screen is a recticle covering 1/2 the revi and 1/2 into space.

This is an aesthetical judgement....nothing to do with realism.

And its exactly the tack I tried to take at the start of the thread. I thought the idea of moving the gun-sight to the centre would be a more 'palatable' option, visually speaking. If you read the thread you can see how well that went down.

So, if moving the gun-sight is off the cards but we still want to simulate what a 109 pilot actually sees it's the projected reticle.

Yep.

As visually unsettling as it may be for some (and i'm not immune to the visual charm of the current set-up) it's the correct way to go. 109 pilot's did not have to mess about to see their gunsight projected before them and if realism is the watchword here (which I have been assured it is by some in this thread ) then a projected reticle should be coded in.

In our Apache simulations no one complains about a big green floating HUD in front of them. No one would dream of complaining about it....it's too obviously a necessary visual element of what the Apache pilot sees when he looks upon the world.

On the other hand the horror being expressed at giving the 109 pilot the exact same visual element is....odd.

[Wolf_Rider]

would technical limitations prohibit that though?

all other sights would (I assume) be coded to float within the confines of the centered sight

[Lixma]

Originally Posted by Wolf_Rider

would technical limitations prohibit that though?

all other sights would (I assume) be coded to float within the confines of the centered sight

You would only be able to see as much or as little of the reticle as your in-game pilot would see with his virtual right eye.

So under G-forces and manoeuvring the reticle image will still be cut off or disappear just like any other gun-sight. It's not like you could see a full reticle in front of you at all times, there is no advantage being sought or gained here.

[Wolf_Rider]

Originally Posted by Lixma

You would only be able to see as much or as little of the reticle as your in-game pilot would see with his virtual right eye.

So under G-forces and manoeuvring the reticle image will still be cut off or disappear just like any other gun-sight. It's not like you could see a full reticle in front of you at all times, there is no advantage being sought or gained here.

sorry, I meant for just "recreating" the RL effect of just having the reticule float on centre screen without having any key command, like currently exists with the Shft + F1

[Wolf_Rider]

Originally Posted by Wolf_Rider

would technical limitations prohibit that though?

all other sights would (I assume) be coded to float within the confines of the centered sight

?

[Lixma]

Originally Posted by Wolf_Rider

would technical limitations prohibit that though?

all other sights would (I assume) be coded to float within the confines of the centered sight

It should not be difficult.

We are simply adjusting the reticles visibility parameters (which are already coded in) into the players line of sight....instead of shifting the players' line of sight to intercept the reticle (which is what Shift-F1 does). It's merely a shift in geometry, not a change in the physics or logic of the display.

Originally Posted by DayGlow

Also aesthetically I don't like the sight just hanging there in 2D space.

But i'll guarantee you'd have no problem with a DCS:Apache HUD hanging there in space. Nobody in their right mind would. But when it comes to the Bf-109....it makes us uneasy.

This is exactly why I started the thread suggesting moving the gunsight to the centre of the dash. I thought this would be aesthetically more palatable than a floating reticle (which, if not done carefully could look pretty odd). But as I found out people were threatening to slit their first-borns' throat than suffer any such concessions to realism.

However, no sooner than a realistic solution is presented - concern for realism is quickly sacrificed on the alter of aesthetics!

The floating reticle would, I freely admit, be weird at first. But for no other reason than it has never been done before in a WW2 flight sim (AFAIK). The received tradition has always been to move the players' perspective to line up with the gunsight, or model the gunsight as centrally mounted. If a floating reticle is realistic then let's have one. In a few years people will be wondering what all the fuss was about.

[David Hayward]

Lixma, you should create a message with charts and graphs and 8x10 glossy photos with circles and arrows and send it to Luthier. Convincing us you are right will not get you very far. You need to convince Luthier.

Personally, I'm fine with a gunsight view that is as close to what the real pilot would experience as possible, even if it looks a little odd.

[Lixma]

Originally Posted by DayGlow

My asthetic issue is the 2-D display. To have the redicle float in space you need to look through it, out to your target. That would mean the cockpit and even the redicle casing (the glass) out of focus. DOF field effects would be an issue because it would have to fixed to the center point of the screen.

That's my aesthetic problem as the whole display is flat and in perfect focus.

Ahh, I see. Understood.

Back onto topic, for me the simplest solution would be an optional keypress pov shift to see the sight in combat. This wouldn't require recoding how the sight functions outside the frame or the issues of 3-D behavior in a 2-D space.

To be honest if it wasn't for the utterly insane version of Shift-F1 we now have in CoD I wouldn't have bothered bringing the subject up in the first place. I can only guess what the programmers had in mind when they designed that view.

[BadAim]

I'll second that Lixma. The Gunsight view is way to slow, it porks TIR and it just generally doesn't make sense. It's a good thing that I love CloD so much or Luthier and Oleg would be looking down the business end of a hissy fit. Seriously, it's a small thing but it is generally annoying in a dogfight.