How Realistic Is The Simulation Mode?

[David603]

Yeah, I always do that with P51s, and I like to fly the P51B-C too because they are a bit lighter than the D.

[Doktorwzzerd]

Originally Posted by butterfield

The only time high G's come into effect is at higher speeds. Like trying to pull out of a dive at 650kph. I've heard a story of I believe a P-38 pilot literally breaking his leg pulling on the stick under a load. The elevators become harder to operate the more wind resistance they have... it's like sticking you hand out the car window at 65mph versus say 200mph.





That's becuase the Spitfire is a plane designed for turning fights. The P-51 is not. Most if not almost all american planes were "hotrods"... big powerful engines, fast with poor low speed manueverability. forget what you see in the movies. Pilots of say a p-51 / cosair/ p-47 / f4f /etc would use tactics involving speed and superior position. dive in fire off a burst then climb to a higher positioni. If there was no energy and they were caught at low speed with a bandit on their tail they were already dead.



Another Boom and Zoom hotrod...but it's small with powerful cannons, quick roll rate, and good high speed turning. Which means its actually good at the scissors at speed. It can hold its own with the turn and burn planes...just got to keep the energy high. If you drop airspeed with no way to recover you are a sitting target.

Good insights! I've been more ginger with the mustang on turns and loops and its now much more fun, I even downed my first 190 so thanks! The ground targets are still hard as heck to hit though.

[Desode]

Hey Doktorwzzerd, Here is some real info on the p-51 and here are the links to videos to back it all up.
I'm sorry but butterfield is not correct on all of his assumptions

Actually I hate to say it, and I don't want to start anything, but the P-51 was a amazing plane. It shot down TONS of enemy aircraft. It could do Crazy tight manuevers that no other plane could do. If a 109 got on a p-51 ones trail, It didn't matter, if the P-51 pilot knew the plane ! That 109 was done for. Example is this right here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pBfwX...eature=related

I also recomend you watch the whole thing. parts 1 - 5

As for your question about pounds on the stick ? In the P51 1 G = 25 pds of pressure you had to hold on the stick. So if you were pulling 6 G's then you were fighting 150 pds with one hand and fighting blackouts and redouts. I recomend you check this site out also. You may have to sign up to see the videos but its free and these guys are AMAZING. They are called the Four Horsemen and they are a group of 4 aerobatic formation guys that fly original p-51's.
http://www.asb.tv/videos/view.php?v=4d13e87f

The video titled " #2 Becomes a Horsemen " explains the stick weight per G and you can pull some serious G's and not be going 600mph.

I have 17 solo hrs in right now, towards my private pilot license and if you turn to quickly in any plane it will do the same thing as the P 51. If you make to quick of a roll to the right it will flip the opposite way. This was more pronounce in the P 51, because its elevators-ect had to be bigger to handle high speed manuevers.
It just takes a lot of work to learn how to fly it, but once you do you'll be in love with it, because it can do things that no other plane could do in the WWII era.

If you want to learn, then do some searching around via the web and find the true history of these amazing aircraft.

These flight models in Il2 are the best there is out there, for any WWII flight sim. You can even go and find the real stats of the real aircraft and they will match with the game Spot on.

I hope this helps you out, Desode

[trk29]

Originally Posted by Desode

I hope this helps you out, Desode

That was awesome. Thanks for the video

[David603]

The History Channel video is interesting, and the P51 pilot was certainly very good, but I would like to see someone try to pull off the manoeuvre that scored the first kill against me. If I was that 109 pilot I would pull up, passing over the P51, and ending up positioned above, with both an energy and an altitude advantage. This would effectively be fight over, or at least me having a major advantage, with the P51 caught at low speed, not enough altitude to trade for speed and not having a low speed manoeuvrability advantage over the Bf109.

[haitch40]

yeh talking about that i came to hate the p51 and the 109 because they r not agile enough for me when im choosing a plane agility is number 1 on my list. fire power 2nd and 3rd speed then comes armour

[mondo]

Originally Posted by haitch40

yeh talking about that i came to hate the p51 and the 109 because they r not agile enough for me when im choosing a plane agility is number 1 on my list. fire power 2nd and 3rd speed then comes armour

They are two of the most agile monoplanes of WW2! Both have good roll rates, good turning rates, some of the 109's have climbing abilities like nothing else and the P51 has excellent high speed control responses. Besides, blanked statements about a 109 are bad since there were so many different versions with different characteristics. Even a G2 is completely different from a G14.

Granted you can get better turners and rollers (although most 109's have superb low speed turning) but your looking at i153's or similar early war 'crap' planes unless you go for a 190 which has a better role rate than anything else.

[mondo]

Originally Posted by Desode

Actually I hate to say it, and I don't want to start anything, but the P-51 was a amazing plane. It shot down TONS of enemy aircraft. It could do Crazy tight manuevers that no other plane could do. If a 109 got on a p-51 ones trail, It didn't matter, if the P-51 pilot knew the plane ! That 109 was done for.

Its the pilot, not the plane that does the shooting down.

Do your research and I don't mean history channel crap, i mean flight data reports, combat evaluations, many 109 variants that fought the P51, like the late G models had similar performance characteristics to them, some better some worse but such blanket statements are BS.

BTW, apart from one of the top 10 aces of all time, flew all flew 109's.

[haitch40]

Originally Posted by mondo

They are two of the most agile monoplanes of WW2! Both have good roll rates, good turning rates, some of the 109's have climbing abilities like nothing else and the P51 has excellent high speed control responses. Besides, blanked statements about a 109 are bad since there were so many different versions with different characteristics. Even a G2 is completely different from a G14.

Granted you can get better turners and rollers (although most 109's have superb low speed turning) but your looking at i153's or similar early war 'crap' planes unless you go for a 190 which has a better role rate than anything else.

ok im not saying they r bad planes i just prefer planes like the spitfire and japanese planes apart from the zero

[mondo]

Originally Posted by Doktorwzzerd

OK here's a historic question:

In a real Spit or P-51 would you even be able to turn the plane way beyond its threshold at 250 mph, given that the controls are purely mechanical? Would you have to be He-Man in order to do it? I've seen WW2 pilots talking about how in high G maneouvers it takes a huge amount of physical strength to work the stick.

There would be a limit on the effectiveness of the control surfaces. The Spitfire (pick a variant, a MkV would easily out turn an XIV) would win though as it has a high lift wing. You can also add trim as well which would help get a tighter turn but then you'd loose all your energy which no pilot would do.