Dogfighting -does 4.11-4.12 patch address this?

[Woke Up Dead]

"Pander to your desire for dogfight entertainment," "whaaambulance," snarky critiques of piloting abilities, what's the matter with you guys?

The QMB is obviously not a place for hyper-realism, it's for setting up "what if" scenarios. Like, what if I spawn in on my opponent's six, 1000m above him, and he has 100% fuel and no ammo and is a rookie and is alone, and I have 20% fuel and an ace wingman. Realistic?

If you can already set all those variables, then why not also be able to set the aggressiveness and likeliness to dogfight of your opponent? Like a lot of online pilots in planes better suited for hit and run do, you know, for fun?

[MaxGunz]

People come in with revisionist agendas, making false assertions and acting like they're right when they're not. Sorry "victim" but you started it and I'm not the only one who's not eating the BS you put on our table.

Woke Up Dead, anyone can set up QMB as they like. With FMB they can even set up the waypoints the targets will use. Make the enemies rookies if that's what it takes... the game already does that and more! Nobody is saying that everyone has to play the same.

As far as historic, goooooood luck! You can approach elements of history but it's a flight sim and game AI hasn't got the resources to make strategy.

Hey FC! Is it possible to network with PC's that only run AI client? No graphics or input devices, all resources given to AI? What could be achieved then, even with older PC's?

[Fenrir]

Originally Posted by Woke Up Dead

"Pander to your desire for dogfight entertainment," "whaaambulance," snarky critiques of piloting abilities, what's the matter with you guys?

You know what WUD, you are right. I reacted badly. However, I found my resentment piqued by Pugos attitude. There's ways and means. if he had come in asking for assistance as to why it is he's having so much difficulty with the AI and what he can do to minimise its apparent advantages, I'd have been much more civil.

Instead he waltzes in and has the temerity to demand that years of hard work trying to get the AI to the convincing level it is now are thrown away just so he can get more kills. It's the classic "you should do the hard work so i don't have to" attitude I see insidiously infecting the social mentality nowadays and it raises my hackles. Why not try asking oneself "what am I doing wrong, how can I improve?"

The QMB is obviously not a place for hyper-realism, it's for setting up "what if" scenarios. Like, what if I spawn in on my opponent's six, 1000m above him, and he has 100% fuel and no ammo and is a rookie and is alone, and I have 20% fuel and an ace wingman. Realistic?

Granted. However, the product is what it is, and strives towards as realistic an experience as the parameters of it's platform & programming limitations allow. Is it perfect? Of course not, but it's a bloody convincing and enjoyable effort. In that spirit, the what if's are also constrained by those parameters and those of the game. If you want a swirling multi-plane melee with everyone trying like hell to turn themselves inside out getting on each others tails - which I have done many times 1-v-1 in Il-2 against the AI (try a P-38J against a 109G-10) - then go buy War Thunder.

If you can already set all those variables, then why not also be able to set the aggressiveness and likeliness to dogfight of your opponent? Like a lot of online pilots in planes better suited for hit and run do, you know, for fun?

As cool as that would be I suspect it's asking too much of both FatCat99 and the Il-2 game engine. It was something that was supposed to be a variable in CloD but unless Team Fusion can work their magic with it I don't know how far we'll see it progress. And even then, having an Ace AI trying to dogfight a Spitfire in Bf109 in the classic interpretation of that term seems paradoxical. In the meantime I stand by my opinion of Il-2 AI air combat tactics - it's the best i have seen in ANY flightsim of recent years and has even fooled me into thinking it was one of my squadmates on occasion.

[Robe55son]

I would like to see how I would fare against multiple aircraft with realistic flight characteristics maintained even with increased number of advesaries.

[Laurwin]

Let me just say though, the AI is good enough to exploit some of it's advantages and punish player for some mistakes.

I just had a terrible mission in Pacific Corsair campaign in 4.12. Mission was scramble from carrier (actually air start 500m alt)

Enemies were 29 Japanese fighters starting from 3000m alt.

We had 6 Allied planes in total, in the air, all starting alt 500m.

You're gonna have to be hell of an ace to beat that one.

I shot down only two of them myself, then there was 25 bandits on my tail chasing me LOL.

Not that it matters much, the Allied planes we had 6 vs 29 disadvantage, allies also had aircraft quality disadvantage hellcats and corsairs in this mission.
(1/4 Ki84, 1/4 early N1K2, the rest were mix of Ki43 and Zekes)

[MaxGunz]

Does anyone else get malware blocked alerts here from their AV?
Because if your AV don't detect them....

[Igo kyu]

Yeah, I get some alerts about dodgy URLs. Seems to depend who posted in the thread. Perhaps some new posters have something invisible and dodgy in their signatures. No, just now got it on the CloD forum with only known posters on the page, must be a hack into/onto the forum.

[Tempest123]

Overall I find 4.12.1 to be a big improvement in terms of evasive maneuvers, nice turns, half rolls, loops etc. Still there is a tendency to do an occasional vertical climb followed by a stall when being chased, which of course usually results in the stalling aircraft being shot down.
There is still the issue of the AI being unable to recognize the need to boom and zoom, for example the Karelian Hawks campaign, the p-36 can run away from the i-153 all day with an altitude advantage, but the AI insists on turn fighting, so your going to lose your whole AI flight once and a while trying to dogfight. I've think i've lost more AI P-36's than Finland even had in the war lol.
The last thing that is improved but still occurs occasionally is AI planes defying physics, pulling 9g's no blacking out, no fatigue, while you're snapping your airframe trying to pull with them, or pulling negative g outside horizontal turns or loops, which would of course be impossible except if we where flying su-31's or something. The AI still posess their "radar" and can tell friend or foe from kilometers away.
I don't know how much more AI tweaking is possible in a 13 year old game engine, but it is better than before