Do we need AI at all? I do not think so...

[Furio]

Originally Posted by LukeFF

I've heard of many half-baked ideas, but this one tops them all.

Agreed. In Italy we use to say “frying air” to define discussing something totally removed from reality. But there is more. A simulator is software doing a simulation. It is its very nature to simulate everything: wind, grass, engines, gasoline properties, bullets, stonewalls, sea, beaches… Why on earth humans should not being simulated? The ultimate goal is exactly the opposite. If we had a really good human being simulation, then we could have not only crews, but also soldiers on the battlefield, and a really ultimate war simulation. We just need computers from year 2050…

[BG-09]

The war and combat decisions, and skils (flight skils) are result of human psichics. Thats why AI can not be compared to human. So only humans can simulate war, because war is human product.

I agree on this:

AI fits for: trains, ships.

But for pilots AI do not fits, because human abilities and behaiviour are unique apearance of the nature. They can not be simulated.

What abbout "historical" missions...well they are historical only in your mind.
Thats why i say: more human envolvment, and less AI.

[csThor]

Originally Posted by BG-09

The war and combat decisions, and skils (flight skils) are result of human psichics. Thats why AI can not be compared to human. So only humans can simulate war, because war is human product.

Pardon, but Bollocks. A military simulation without AI is impossible because human players do not follow orders (no snipes at current AI issues pls ), don't use historical tactics or fly any aircraft they're being assigned. Human players play for fun, their fun to be precise, and that means they will follow their own paths, do their own thing and if some kind of cooperation comes out of it that is mere coincidence.

Originally Posted by BG-09

But for pilots AI do not fits, because human abilities and behaiviour are unique apearance of the nature. They can not be simulated.

True to a point. But AI can be programmed to act like the historical pilots (in theory, that is). No human player would follow tactics and orders which ran contrary to his common sense. Or would you adhere to flying vics when the Finger-4 is so much more effective? Pilots back then didn't have a say in such matters ...

And quite honestly: Given the amount of ego-driven whines, flames and crybaby alerts I had to see over the years I doubt the majority of people is interested in historical missions - all they seem to want is clusterf*cking with the latest über-fighters so that they can stroke their ego and pretend they're [insert-historical-ace] reborn. And there I can say with utter conviction: Thanks, I'll pass.

[Nephris]

Well...gentlemen...

I think

God beware you keep on,m8!

[Madfish]

And to add to the points csThor pointed out: Not only do humans not follow orders - they also and most importantly do NOT have the psyche of a soldier during the times of WWII.
Do we lose our comrades in battle? Do we see them wounded, shot down, blown to pieces, traumatized? Do we experience this? Do we get wounded, shot down, almost killed? Do we kill?

The psyche of a gamer is totally different and thus you can't simulate "war" in games even with real people. In fact real people might be even worse than programmed AI.

The reason is simple: you say for pilots AI doesn't fit. Well, I say it's almost the other way round. Todays virtual pilots are very much different from the real pilots during the war. Not only we differ in psyche but also we have the knowledge that the pilots didn't have at that time. We know the precise numbers behind plance performance, structural weaknesses, FM capabilities etc.
We also do not have to be physically fit at all and many virtual pilots wouldn't even fit into a fighter pit.

And what about culture, media exposure? There are so many factors involved... even just the simple fact that we KNOW the outcome of the war changes everything. Historic campaigns? Not happening anymore, ever.


As I said in my first post: a game like CloD or anything like it without AI won't happen and wouldn't work.