4.11: Some Missions Locking-Up

[IceFire]

That's really weird Aviar... before and after release I went through all kinds of missions testing them out with a variety of different sequences, scenes, and other scenarios and never did I have that happen.

Does this only happen when it's being hosted as a coop or does it happen if run through the FMB or a single mission as well? I skimmed through all of the posts and I didn't see that mentioned. My apologies if you did mention it. I'm going to test the mission in a few!

[Aviar]

Originally Posted by IceFire

That's really weird Aviar... before and after release I went through all kinds of missions testing them out with a variety of different sequences, scenes, and other scenarios and never did I have that happen.

Does this only happen when it's being hosted as a coop or does it happen if run through the FMB or a single mission as well? I skimmed through all of the posts and I didn't see that mentioned. My apologies if you did mention it. I'm going to test the mission in a few!

Thanks for being concerned. I know my first post was a little long, but the answer to your question at the bottom of that post.

In short, it happens basically all the time. Online coops, offline coop testing and then simply running the mission straight from the FMB. The latter is the quickest way to test it. Just accelerate it to 2x or 4x and let it run. Changing views and scrolling through the different flights sometimes seems to accelerate the lock-up time. This is why it seems like some sort of paging or memory issue. Many times it will lock up as I am moving my mouse or zooming the view in/out.

I want to thank you for giving of your personal time in the testing of the beta. I know it's not easy. However, I played the heck out of 4.11 for weeks before I found the first lock-up. It was simply because I had not played one of these 'bigger' missions in my folder. It's just like a bug that gets by all the testers and gets released in the final. It happens....we all know that.

But even now I'm still not comfortable calling it a 'bug'. Maybe there is something unique to my computer and eventually I can resolve the issue.

Aviar

[IceFire]

Tested it and confirmed. Locked my system too. You say this happens often to you... any commonality between the missions that this occurs in? Same map? Same type of complexity? You do have a lot of aircraft and quite a few vehicle waypoints... more than I tend to use on an average basis. Just thinking out loud.

[Aviar]

Originally Posted by IceFire

Tested it and confirmed. Locked my system too. You say this happens often to you... any commonality between the missions that this occurs in? Same map? Same type of complexity? You do have a lot of aircraft and quite a few vehicle waypoints... more than I tend to use on an average basis. Just thinking out loud.

Just to clarify, I did not say this happens 'often' to me.

As I mentioned earlier, I pretty much detailed everything in my first post. I know it is a little long but if it is read closely, the info is in there.

As I stated, these seem to be a combination of 'big' maps and 'big' missions. The Solomons map(s) are just about the biggest maps in IL-2. So when you load even the blank map, your computer is already being taxed. If you combine that with a very busy (big) mission.....well you see that could eventually be an issue. (Again, I stated that I have 'smaller' missions on the Solomons map that work just fine in 4.11.)

Over the years, I have seen many posts that a certain individual could not load a particular map or mission....usually because of RAM issues. This is not unusual. Even the best and fastest computers have a physical limit.

***The strange part of my issue is that the same missions that are locking up in 4.11 are playing perfectly fine in 4.10.1....on the same computer.***

So, my common sense is telling me that my computer is fine and there may be an issue with 4.11. Does that make sense to you?

* Maybe all the new calculations for FM, AI, head tracking, moving plane parts online, etc. are stressing the IL-2 code? Too much info?

Aviar

[IceFire]

Definitely makes sense.

Yes the Solomons map does appear to be quite taxing. We tried to use it for a scenario on Battlefields1 and while the map ran fine for most players we had to pull it because some players weren't able to load past 90-92% and others would load but had missing textures on the ground or on planes. It's too bad because it's a beautiful map but some machines I guess are not quite up to the task.

I would agree with you that it is some sort of game related issue. In particular because the lockup does not affect the hardware. The game does lock up but you can alt-tab out and shut down the IL2 process without difficulty or loss of stability... and given that it happens on more than one system it's not likely to be a system specific problem either.

So big map and big missions...I'll have to have a look. See if I can recreate the same issues on other mission examples.

[Aviar]

Just for fun, I decided to create a '4.11 Stress Test' mission. I thought it might be a good idea if we were going to do some more testing on this issue.

So of course I used the Solomoms 1944 map. Then I placed a lot more planes than I had in the mission I posted here earlier...the one that was locking up.

In this mission, I currently have:

64 B-29

32 B-25

16 P-38

48 Ki-61

16 H8k1

Now that's a lot of planes. Also, all the gunners in the bombers have their own AI and so that puts a lot of additional stress in terms of calculations into the mission.

So I tried one of the more simple tests. I loaded the mission into the FMB and chose Play. I then set the Autopilot on the Player aircraft. Then I accelerated the game to 4x and just watched.

Nothing happened. The mission did not lock up. So what might we learn from this? Some thoughts:

1. The first thing that came to mind was....the first mission was created in 4.10 and this stress mission was created in 4.11. Now, on the surface, that should not make a difference. One reason being is that I made the stress mission very 'generic', meaning that I could easily install it in 4.10 and it would play. (This is because I did not use any of the new 4.11 features or planes.)

So, could this be a possible answer? (Certain missions created BEFORE 4.11 may cause the game to lock up during the mission, if played in 4.11.)

That's an interesting thought. The first thing that then comes to mind is....why not go into 4.10.1 and rebuild the stress mission from scratch. Then take THAT mission and test it in 4.11. If the 4.10.1 stress test mission were to lock up in 4.11, that certainly would be interesting information.

What do you think?


2.Ok, the second thought was that although the stress mission was 'bigger' than the coop mision (we'll call it the Torikina mission from now on), it was different in that in many ways it was 'simplier'.

What I mean is this. The stress mission was made as a test, so I just had all the planes start in mid-air. They all had just 2 waypoints. So basically they all just flew from point A to point B. This will still stress a computer, but remember, we are trying to find some differences. (I later added 16 Ki-61's which attacked certain bomber flights, so there WAS a good amount of combat action...which increases the stress factor.)

The Torikina coop was a 'real' mission. It had takeoffs, landings, more waypoints, attack waypoints, flights with delayed spawning, etc.

Could some of these differences be the answer to why the 4.11 stress mission did not lock up? I don't know.

The obvious answer is to try and build a brand new big 'real' mission on the Solomons map and see what happens. I mean, if that mission would still lock up then that question would be answered.

Does that make sense?

So there are 2 points of thought right there. Does anyone have more?

**I have also attached the 4.11 Stress Test mission in case somebody wants to mess around with it.

EDIT: One interesting fact I forgot to mention. I tested the Stress Mission in both 4.11 and 4.10.1. Although the mission played fine in both versions, there was a difference between the two.

After I played the mission from the 4.11 FMB at 4x speed, after about 30 minutes (in-game time) I decided to end the mission. After I hit Escape, clicked Quit Mission and then clicked on Done, the game locked up. It would not reload the mission back into the FMB. So again, does this seem to indicate some sort of memory-type issue in 4.11?

When I did the same test in 4.10.1, there was no lock-up at all. I tested the mission, quit the mission and then the mission reloaded right back into the FMB. So again, there seems to be a reproducable difference between 4.11 and 4.10.1.


Aviar

[IceFire]

Total conjecture... you had one or two vehicles (groups?) traveling between one side of the island and the other. There were a significant number of way points. I'm not sure if vehicle AI has been altered in any way but it's worth factoring in.

[KU_Rigamortis]

I get the same IL-2 failure to respond with the Solomon's map. Running a rather large (126kb) dogfight mission and testing in FMB using 2x, 4x, and 8x acceleration to verify sequencing of AI.

I can exit out of FMB and back to the main IL-2 screen, but when I then click any other screen button, I get a second mouse pointer and a blue spinning circle. IL-2 never responds beyond this point and I have to CTRL-ALT-DEL to exit.