Reno air crash ( P51 )

[Mad G]

Originally Posted by ElAurens

Here is the photo I referenced.

Note the missing left elevator trim tab.

Not the first time this has happened to a P 51.

Also can be noticed the pilot´s helmet near the cockpit´s panel.

[bongodriver]

Originally Posted by Mad G

Also can be noticed the pilot´s helmet near the cockpit´s panel.

To be honest there is absolutely no way to tell that is what it is, it could be the instrument shroud, I get the feeling there are some who wan't to see it as such, but who knows....maybe he was unconcious, from mystycpumas video it almost seems like some sort of failure might have caused an uncommanded pitch up, which could have caught the pilot by such surprise he never managed to g srtain in time, at 500 mph an unexpected pitch up is going to load up massive amounts of g in a split second.

[Romanator21]

1=maximum age fly high g display and performance aircraft imo age 55 tops men woman =50
2=all aircraft be it a cessna air trike to a 747 , hot air balloon outfitted with some tracking and recording unit in the event of crash and recover, data can be pulled from it to narrow down cause.
3= display crowds pushed back from flighline runway no fly zones increased.

1) To be fair diveplane, having separate retirement ages based on sex is in fact sexist. They don't give out driver's licenses at different ages based on sex...

I get the fact that everyone is concerned about the pilot's age, but every pilot over a certain age or flying a certain type of aircraft undergoes a thorough medical examination at least every year. Even some 18-year-olds aren't fit to fly. The pilot in this case was strong and fit, and often outperformed many of the young lads. He was experienced and well qualified. The truth is, this was a mechanical failure, and it could have happened to anybody.

In fact, according to one report, he may have well saved lives. Apparently, the plane was going down uncontrollably and would have gone into the crows at a shallow angle, easily taking out hundreds of people. He could have been trying to dive nose first directly into the tarmac to avoid the crowd and minimize the effect of the debris. While this is a tragic occurence, it could have been much worse (In Ukraine a jet flew into the crowd after an engine failure. The pilots had been denied extra practice time, and were also not briefed as to the location of the crowd. The pilot instinctively pulled up to save the plane, but the plane then skidded along the ground, claiming almost 100 lives.)

2) Black boxes are between $10,000 and $15,000 each. They are large and heavy. If you put one in a C.152 there will be no place for the pilot. Considering the huge cost of the device, the FAA isn't going to subsidize that for every single plane or balloon. The cost is going to be shouldered by private aviation enthusiasts who are already paying through the nose. I had to take insane student loans to learn to fly a little Cessna 172, and I'll probably never pay them off completely before I die. Recreational amateur aviation, which started with the Wrights, Bleriot, Curtiss, Lindbergh, etc. will disappear.

3) I want to agree with you on this point, but these people chose to be there. I personally haven't been to an air display, and if I will go, I'll try to be sure that the seating arrangement is safe. It's a bit brutal for me to say this, but those folks knew that they were watching some potentially dangerous stuff. It's a risk that everyone takes when going to one of these shows.

While some safety measures should be implemented, like warning placards or having spectators sign a release, it wouldn't be the best idea to move the seats 5 km away. Frankly, that would defeat the purpose of going to an airshow in the first place, and in reality, does little or nothing to mitigate the risk (a plane can go out of control and travel that distance very quickly).


This is a shocking and horrifying tragedy, and my sincere condolences go out to the families of those lost and injured, but knee-jerk reactions like this are slowly suffocating private aviation in the US. Instead, we should take a moment to think about the best way to deal with this situation in everyone's favor and be prepared to deal with the risks when we do decide to enjoy an air show or similar event.

[ElAurens]

The reason...

450+mph.

Trim tab fails.

High G nose up attitude because of broken trim tab.

Pilot blacks out, seat collapses, etc...

Pretty much spells it out.

[bongodriver]

Originally Posted by ElAurens

The reason...

450+mph.

Trim tab fails.

High G nose up attitude because of broken trim tab.

Pilot blacks out, seat collapses, etc...

Pretty much spells it out.

Now that is all the evidence I need to see........christ! poor guy had no chance.

[winny]

Wow, such a small part of the aircraft too.

That last video does look like he's trying hard to roll away from the crowd. It always amazes me how self-less pilot's can be when they know they're in trouble, without fail they think about the people on the ground.

Respect to him.

[Flying Pencil]

Originally Posted by Baron

Sounds like a really good idea to let a 74 year old fly in that venue (high stake racing).


Wonder why we don't see that more often in say F1.


Condolences to those who died needlessly.



P.S. Not insulting the pilot or anyone, more the setup/phenomenon that is Unlimited Reno Air Racing = Extreme risk no rules no restriction what's the point racing. Imo.

PERFECT EXAMPLE of ignorant person spewing emotion tainted garbage the hurts everyone!!!1!one!

You sir, have GRIEVOUSLY INSULTED the family, air show events, the entire aviation community, and motor sports as well!

Car races and boat races kill participants and spectators EVERY YEAR. Why should air races be held to a different standard?

People operate dangerous machines into there 80's perfectly safely (and are medically checked out)

ALL organization endeavor to safety but nothing is 100%. It was years since the last spectator was injured in an aviation related accident.



Sent from my iPod Touch 4G using Tapatalk

[Flying Pencil]

Originally Posted by bongodriver

Now that is all the evidence I need to see........christ! poor guy had no chance.

Negative!

Trim tabs do not fly the airplane, they HELP fly the airplane!

That said, flying that fast it would be very difficult to fight the forces and control it.


Sent from my iPod Touch 4G using Tapatalk

[bongodriver]

Originally Posted by Flying Pencil

Negative!

Trim tabs do not fly the airplane, they HELP fly the airplane!

That said, flying that fast it would be very difficult to fight the forces and control it.


Sent from my iPod Touch 4G using Tapatalk

Trust me I know what trim tabs do, that said what exactly are you disagreeing with, aren't you just confirming my point?

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=ffe_1316240833

High res video. You can see his parachute deploy from the impact. Ouch.