Suddenly Spit IIa on all the servers?

[TomcatViP]

Originally Posted by David198502

dont you mean increase the proppitch???at least on the gauge its an increase of it.

The Prop pitch is relative to the angle btw the blade and the propeller disc. The more angle the more propulsive force you generate at each blade revolution. But the more torque your engine has to deliver.

Think of a screw'thread. If the pitch is 1mm per each revolution the screw will travel for 1mm at each revolution in the direction of its main axis . If the thread is 1.25mm then 1 rev = 1.25mm travel distance.

In maths, angles are counted positively counterclockwise. [http://www.sosmath.com/trig/Trig1/trig1/trig1.html]

Engineer being what they are, they hve designed here an instrument that looks like a clock but is not. You have to read on the trigonometric way with the pitch increasing when the dial travel counterclockwise. Hence Increasing the blade angle means increasing the pitch on gauge with the dial traveling from right to the left.

Respectively, decreasing the blade angle means decreasing the pitch with the dial moving clockwise

Yes it's weird. Sometime teh worst thing to do is to ask some engineers

Originally Posted by David198502

when do i know that i overreved the engine enough??

It depends of your alt.

But if you look at the ata gauge you'll see that the dial hop to a larger value (around 0.2 ata more) signaling that the compressor blows compressed air to the eng.

With the new ata value you can then slightly increase the pitch (counterclockwise) to use the extra power available for building speed.

Originally Posted by David198502

i observed, that when i go from level flight into a climb, and increase the prop pitch(meaning going from 10 to eleven o clock on the gauge)

he he that is Lowering the pitch (clockwise - remember the positive way is the other one from the right to left))

Originally Posted by David198502

there comes the point, where suddenly the ata pressure decreases slightly the more i increase the prop pitch......is that the point where i should stop increasing the pp?

You might be overreving your engine. I hve to see that.

Originally Posted by David198502

is it advisable to maintain the highest possible ata pressure all the time?

No. Eng put on strain = raise in temp with an increased risk of failure or a lower time available at full power once the fight begin.

Perso I like to begin a fight with a cold engine and for such Cruise at low power (low ata) and high blade angle. The 109 has a very good cruise speed thx to a better aero efficient design. Cruise speed is in the range of a low 350 to a high 400kph TAS for the E model

Originally Posted by David198502

meaning in combat situation, i mainly fly with full throttle and only adjust the pp.through change of the prop pitch, the pressure changes as well, ....
so if i maintain 1,325ata with full throttle...would that be the way to go????

YES !

However playing with the throttle is of great help in a fight. Hence I am ctly handling both command unless I am B&Zing with both value only slightly moving around the 1.32/10h values just like you.

~S!

[VO101_Tom]

Originally Posted by Ze-Jamz

Lol, I know what your trying to say but your miles away from what I mean..

Ok, we misunderstood each other. I thought we are talking about Spit IIa

[Ze-Jamz]

Originally Posted by VO101_Tom

Ok, we misunderstood each other. I thought we are talking about Spit IIa

~S~

Lol I was

Right up until the Early Spit-V and the 109-f4 then the Spits started to get the edge so that whole BnZ tactic with the dive speed, climb speed and turn radius (at speed) fell down to the introduction of the FW-190

I know this is just a rough sketch if you like but you get my meaning..

In a nutshell the Spit2a should not have that much of an advantage over the 109-e4 that we see in game presently irrespective to FM's, right or wrong, documentation etc...Im talking about what we have in game right now

[Ataros]

Do not know if this video was posted before but hope it can bring some faith in Emil back.

4 vs. 4 it should not be as bad as 1 vs. 1.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=emYem...layer_embedded

PS. I know that it is easier to say so than to do it but I think the idea should be not to outperform or outfly the Spit2 but to kill it using E4's superior and deadly firepower on the 1st or 2nd pass. Of cause not 1 vs. 1.

[David198502]

thx tomcat for your answer.

[5./JG27.Farber]

Seems to be that most people are not douche bags and dont fly the Spit IIa. Just for you information 5./JG27 Server is currently hosting an Adlertag Mission without the 109Emil 4 or the Spit IIa... has been for some time.

[Gollum]

Originally Posted by 5./JG27.Farber

Seems to be that most people are not douche bags and dont fly the Spit IIa. Just for you information 5./JG27 Server is currently hosting an Adlertag Mission without the 109Emil 4 or the Spit IIa... has been for some time.

I fly repka 2 mostly because it usually has the most people on and the map isn't rediculously big for the aount of players. I'de prefer a full real server but the english channel map is huge for the amount of people playing.

I'm not stating this for all servers but repka 2 is full of spit 2as. I just played on it 10 minutes ago and almost everyone on red was a 2a.

What does this mean?

Scully (my wingman) and I were patroling at 400 KM when he noticed 2 dots approaching from our 6 oclock low. We had plenty of distance so we engaged afterburner and tried to climb away. when afterburner ran out we pulled a slight banking left to check 6. the two dots were closing in. (Crap 2a).. The only idea left was to attempt a drag and bag. My wingman turned (to bait the spit) and dove to our 2 Oclock while I climbed. The lead spit took the bait and followed in the dive (usually a fatal mistake in a spit). I quickly inverted and dove in persuit ignoring the 2nd for my wingmans sake while also assuming I had him beat in the dive.

What happened?

My wingman quickly reached 700 KPH hoping to get distance since the dive started with a negative g dive. I also hoped to gain on the spit in the high speed dive and clear my wingmans tail while the spit was focussed on said wingman and said wingman was outdiving the spit. Unfortunately the spits outdove both of us. The lead spit outran me and killed my wingman while the second spit cought up to me and disabled my controls. Keep in mind this was a prolonged dive from 400 KM. There was lots of room between all planes and the dive lasted a good 30 seconds before shots were fired. The sky was angry that day my friend, this was no girly dive. Wings were creaking.

To add insult to injury. I bailed, parachute didn't deploy, and i supermaned into the side of the red mountain airfield. This part I actually enjoyed.

Hehe.

Conclusion,
There is no tactic to kill spit 2a unless you have a large altitute advantage and he doesnt see you.

Or hes a poor shot and you give him lots of time behind a friendlies tail.

I'm all for realism guys but atleast limit the amount of them. whats the actual combat statistic? 40 percent?
Gollum.

[Gollum]

Originally Posted by Ataros

Do not know if this video was posted before but hope it can bring some faith in Emil back.

4 vs. 4 it should not be as bad as 1 vs. 1.

PS. I know that it is easier to say so than to do it but I think the idea should be not to outperform or outfly the Spit2 but to kill it using E4's superior and deadly firepower on the 1st or 2nd pass. Of cause not 1 vs. 1.

This is assuming you get a first pass. You can only bring guns to bear on it if you have suprise and large altitude advantage, or superior numbers (however this means some unfortunate pilot has the job of being the dancing monkey) And im sorry for forgetting this but theres also luck. With a 4 vs 4 you may be correct though. More chances of lining up shots with superior fire power since there will be dancing monkeys involved. If 4 spits are on the tail of 4 109s, its possible that 3 of those 109s are chasing 3 of those spits and firepower may come into play since the 109s can do more damge.

The real question though is, is the current FM and numbers of the 2a historacally correct compared to the 109 E4. At this point I dont think so. I dont know enough about the FM but most are saying that it is either overmodeled or the 109 is undermodeled. There is also the question of numbers. Did the RAF have 100 percent of their squadrens outfitted with these? allowing everyone to chose one on a server says they did. I dont mind not getting an e4 and being forced to fly and 3 or 1 if thats how it goes. Ide rather that then having everyone dominate in a superior plane. Plane restrictions is the only way to deal with this. If the next german plane is better than the 2a, restrict the crap out of it historically. Thats the fair way to do it in my opinion. At least you only have to watch out for a a few of them instead of all of them. Just an opinion though.

I just wan't realism. I'm willing to take a disadvantage if it is historical but I don't think 100 percent of the fighters the e4 faced were 2a. I'm not saying they should be banned. Just saying they should have the FMs proper and in proper numbers so it's not a massacre up there.

in the last few flights i took. the only kills i got were sneak attacks from above. all other engagements were futile. (see superman story above)

hehe. Gnight all

Gollum

[Danelov]

Originally Posted by Gollum

The real question though is, is the current FM and numbers of the 2a historacally correct compared to the 109 E4. At this point I dont think so. I dont know enough about the FM but most are saying that it is either overmodeled or the 109 is undermodeled. There is also the question of numbers. Did the RAF have 100 percent of their squadrens outfitted with these? allowing everyone to chose one on a server says they did. I dont mind not getting an e4 and being forced to fly and 3 or 1 if thats how it goes. Ide rather that then having everyone dominate in a superior plane. Plane restrictions is the only way to deal with this. If the next german plane is better than the 2a, restrict the crap out of it historically. Gollum

About the historical numbers:

Spitfire MK II : 750 produced(from June 1940), entry in service in August 1940with the 611th Squadron.

Messerschmitt 109E-4: 250 produced(from May 1940)
Messerschmitt 109E-4B: 211 produced(from Aug 1940)

A good number of E-3 were refitted in field as E-4s.
The E-4 make his aparition in high numbers after August 1940. Before , bulk of operations(and losses)was supported by the E-1s.

If the intention was to reproduced the battle after historical numbers :

July
-No Spitfire MK II, very few E-4s. A lot of E-1s and a few E-3s.
August
-Some Spitfires MK II, some more E-4 , still a lot of E-1s , few E-3s.
September
-More Spitfire MK II, More E-4s, a little less E-1s and very few E-3. A dozen of E-7s.
October
-Near all Spitfire MK II and E-4s and some more E-7s, still a good number of E-1s. any E-3.
Novembrer
-Spitfires MK II, E-4s and E-7s, very few E-1s, any E-3.

[SEE]

Some interesting numbers their Danelov. Imagine trying to sort that out on MP servers for historical accuracy- it would be impossible.

Leaving the Mk2 out isn't the problem for many Spit jockeys wether for performance or historical reasons. Being left with a Mk1 with two speed prop and a Hurricane that outpaces it also fails on historical/performance correctness. But, it's a 'fair play' compromise for MP untill the FM's are tweaked.