BF109 - Can't we just have the gunsight in the middle?

[Lixma]

Originally Posted by Hatch

So which is more real then ?

The perception of reality is so subjective.

I think it's a viable alternative, and should be an option for those that wish to simulate real life

In real life the 109 pilots (and FW-190) did not have to lean over to the right to see the reticle clearly. The cockpits were cramped enough as it was. If the pilots really did have to lean over to the right just to get a clear image it's surprising that no bright soul ever thought to mount the gunsight centrally rather than offset to the right.

In CoD we have a beautifully modelled cockpit. However we are handicapped with a Cyclopean view of it due to the nature and limitations of a 2D display. And, so, work-arounds such as Shift F-1 or using Track-IR to lean over are necessary.

Unfortunately these work-arounds are being mistaken for reality. The reasons given range from "Go play Hawx noob" to "I've gotten used to it, it's easy with practice".....none of which have any connection with simulation as far as I can tell.

[heloguy]

Originally Posted by Lixma

And here is what a pilot with two eyes open would see....

As a pilot that flies with HUD every once in awhile, no, that's not what you would see. If I adjust the HUD so only half of it is visible in my right eye, I don't magically see the reverse of that half mirrored on the left. I only see the half, unless I adjust it back to center. HUD, and reflector sights are pretty much the same thing, it's just that the HUD shows information from a processor, instead of only an image of a gunsight. The way it's modeled now is correct.

[Lixma]

Originally Posted by heloguy

As a pilot that flies with HUD every once in awhile, no, that's not what you would see. If I adjust the HUD so only half of it is visible in my right eye, I don't magically see the reverse of that half mirrored on the left.

Then don't adjust the HUD so only half of it is visible in your right eye.

The offset Revi sight in the 109 projects a full image onto the right eye, not half.

[Sauf]

Originally Posted by Lixma

Then don't adjust the HUD so only half of it is visible in your right eye.

The offset Revi sight in the 109 projects a full image onto the right eye, not half.

Correct, if the pilot leans a bit to the right! ie loosen straps. Back to where we started.

[Voyager]

Originally Posted by Sauf

Correct, if the pilot leans a bit to the right! ie loosen straps. Back to where we started.

So leaning to the right requires 2-3 seconds of horsing around, and then bolts your head down?

You might want to see a chiropractor, because something is really wrong with your neck.

I now understand what Lixma continually explains.

I just come to thinking that both the cockpit of the 109 and the 190 was sooo small that the final paralaxis was insufficient to make the pilot lean to the side in order to align to the sight.

See real historic picture of the 190, the revi's left edge as seen by the pilot is cockpit centred:


The Focke pilot actually sits quite centred while his right eye is spot on on the revi sight. The left edge of the reflector glass is centred as is the pilot's nose which is pressumably in the middle between both eyes. My guess is that the pilot sees the full image of the aim circle as much as I see my hand when I hold it in front of the right half of my face. And I still can regognize it as a hand but the image is that it is superimposed with the background like putting to photo slides together. You can easily try this yourself without any particular equipment.

It is a bit difficult as both eyes will focus at two different distances that is a bit strenuous when you hold your hand that way. However this problem is inexistent for the revi sight as the aim circle was projected as if in far away distance is I understand correctly, so no focus problem.

[kimosabi]

I don't know where people get from that you lean to the sides. You move your head slightly over, which this picture clearly shows. Are you all wearing neck-supports or something?

[Lixma]

Originally Posted by Sauf

Correct, if the pilot leans a bit to the right! ie loosen straps. Back to where we started.

Nope.

The gunsights were installed directly in the right eye's line of sight. And further adjusted to suit the individual pilots.

Originally Posted by 41Sqn_Stormcrow

I am not sure if the gunsights back then were used as modern helmet mounted Huds are.

The analogy may not be perfect (else it wouldn't be an analogy ) but the concept is the same.

[JG52Krupi]

Originally Posted by 41Sqn_Stormcrow

I now understand what Lixma continually explains.

I just come to thinking that both the cockpit of the 109 and the 190 was sooo small that the final paralaxis was insufficient to make the pilot lean to the side in order to align to the sight.

See real historic picture of the 190, the revi's left edge as seen by the pilot is cockpit centred:


The Focke pilot actually sits quite centred while his right eye is spot on on the revi sight. The left edge of the reflector glass is centred as is the pilot's nose which is pressumably in the middle between both eyes. My guess is that the pilot sees the full image of the aim circle as much as I see my hand when I hold it in front of the right half of my face. And I still can regognize it as a hand but the image is that it is superimposed with the background like putting to photo slides together. You can easily try this yourself without any particular equipment.

It is a bit difficult as both eyes will focus at two different distances that is a bit strenuous when you hold your hand that way. However this problem is inexistent for the revi sight as the aim circle was projected as if in far away distance is I understand correctly, so no focus problem.

So that guys head is in the center is it HAHAHAHAHAHA, open your eyes.

[Baron]

Originally Posted by JG52Krupi

So that guys head is in the center is it HAHAHAHAHAHA, open your eyes.

Cant figure out why u are arguing against changing how shift F1 works in CoD.

Something tells me neither do u.