Friday 2010-12-03 Dev. update and Discussion

[nearmiss]

Most mission builders are probably like myself... very excited about this update.

The scripting ability is very important.

I recall trying to build missions campaigns using Pokryskinin air tactics in 1943 flying the P39. I could not do it because all flights would attack en masse. Pokryskinin's tactic was to maintain aircraft in altitude tiers until the air combat advanced. The upper altitude flights would incrementally drop into the combat with greater E onto the 109s and 190s destroying them with the P39 cannon.

This is just one example of course. The AI performance package should have some scripting options as well, to create tactical encounters.

The ability to arrange objects then group and store them as files would be a great help. Groups that would allow including objects with waypoints and other data would make mission building much more efficient. A further help would be to have timing you could set for certain objects within groups of objects at one time. Example : If you are setting delay time and direction for Flak guns at one time for all flak guns.

It would be a great help to have explosions and and other such objects on waypoints so you could build battles in process as you fly into combat areas.

Very important to have navigation ability for player to fly without having to follow waypoints. No matter if AI aircraft fly waypoints. Player flight should not be restricted to flight paths or altitudes. Autopilot for player should be determined with individual player settings on-the-fly.

Most programming tools developed for IL2 were just text editor tools that worked with the *.mis files. The QMT is a good example.

I can go on for pages and pages like many other mission builders.

One thing that would be awesome... to know the FMB will get periodic updates to further facilitate mission builders as new patches and addons are made available.

Thanks Oleg, I'm printing out all the screenshots and carefully studying them to get a more thorough understanding. Oleg there are some excellent mission builders who have posted this thread. It is good to see them here responding to your update.

[Igo kyu]

Originally Posted by nearmiss

Very important to have navigation ability for player to fly without having to follow waypoints. No matter if AI aircraft fly waypoints. Player flight should not be restricted to flight paths or altitudes. Autopilot for player should be determined with individual player settings on-the-fly.

The way I look at that is that the (single player) player should be able to change waypoints for his/her own aircraft/flight while the mission is in progress.

In fact, that's a wish for general single player play, not mission building.

[fruitbat]

i'm glad the GUI is the same.

for those who are familiar with the il2 FMB such as myself, it will make the transition very easy, and it seems as though my wish list for the FMB is complete, so i am very happy.

for those who are complaining about the GUI of the il2 FMB, and its difficulties, you obviously haven't bothered to spend more than 10 mins on it and gave up, its very easy to use if you can be bothered to spend a couple of hours learning it, and is far easier than other mission building stuff I've used.

A funkier GUI won't change the fact that you will still have to take some time to learn how to use it....

[Trooper117]

I have to admit, the first thing I thanked the gods for when I saw this update was the fact that the man has kept the FMB very close to the original.. that will make the transition for people like me to leap straight in and virtualy create missions from day one, even without learning all the new features.
The thing I would like to ask is that will there be some sort of pdf or booklet on release to directly explain all the new features?.. Thanks in advance!

[Oleg Maddox]

Originally Posted by fruitbat

A funkier GUI won't change the fact that you will still have to take some time to learn how to use it....

Exactly

[nearmiss]

I hope the sort options for the objects database is very complete.

That may be the case, but since I cannot see the sort options I mention this.

It is very tedious to find and select relative objects in scans of the large databases.

Working efficiently with the databases of objects in FMB should be priority.

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It is good you have enlarged the scroll blocks on the sides of the FMB map pages.

Those little scroll blocks in the IL2 have often been difficult to use because of the small size.

[fruitbat]

@Oleg,

1) will the 4 plane per flight limit still apply as in il2?

2) if so, will we be able to clone flights such as in 3rd party apps such as Shift E's Quick Mission Tuner, or is this what the 'group properties' is for?

[nearmiss]

Originally Posted by fruitbat

@Oleg,

1) will the 4 plane per flight limit still apply as in il2?

2) if so, will we be able to clone flights such as in 3rd party apps such as Shift E's Quick Mission Tuner, or is this what the 'group properties' is for?

Actually, the QMT is an editor of the *.mis files with pre-sets and uses IL2 objects databases items that are selectable within the QMT. The ability to work and edit the *.mis (ini type files) would definitely be an improvement. This could all be done through the FMB of course.

Shift E has done an excellent job of keeping up with database items in the addons and patches of IL2.

[fruitbat]

Originally Posted by nearmiss

Actually, the QMT is an editor of the *.mis files with pre-sets and uses IL2 objects databases items that are selectable within the QMT. The ability to work and edit the *.mis (ini type files) would definitely be an improvement. This could all be done through the FMB of course.

Shift E has done an excellent job of keeping up with database items in the addons and patches of IL2.

umm, not sure if your mixing up mission mate with QMT maybe. Missionmate certainly does use presets.

Maybe you can use presets in QMT, but i use QMT to tweak co-ops a lot, and one of the functions I use alot, is to clone an existing set of waypoints from within any .mis file that you've loaded in, and are working on.

so if theres already a flight of 4 bombers, in the mission, i can just clone that flight, select vertical and horizontal offset, and hey presto, i can have 12 bombers in that formation, within that mission.

[Osprey]

Dear Oleg,

Could I respectfully ask you not to waste your time on trying to justify yourself to people that are obtuse regarding a feature because you have limited time and there are many very valid and interesting questions asked that I would love to see answered

As a mission builder myself, I concur with a number of the other questions raised but here's a few things not mentioned:

1. Does the new FMB allow the use of AI in dogfight mode maps? Indeed, does co-op and dogfight now share features as can be achieved with mods in il2 today? In IL2 AI was fixed to co-op but this function was modded with considerable success. This is important because if one were flying a BoB map online I would like to face a large formation on it's way to bomb England, not sporadic pairs of bombers on their way to individual targets. There are other immersive advantages.

2. Would we have the ability to limit the supply of aircraft and their loadouts at airfields? Land damaged and be destroyed and the aircraft is removed from the pool since it is taken for repair
3. Can we group items together? When I set up AAA at an airfield I like to surround it with sandbagging and ammo boxes, perhaps a truck and men. This takes a lot of time - I would like to select all these items as a group, perhaps even save them as a custom object name 'AAA post' and then place and align them on the airfield at once.
4. Can we group squadrons into formations as one, then have a method to split them to different targets? I am referring to multiple squadrons of mixed types into gaggles of aircraft. Formations in the BOB often arrived as one large group then split off in different directions to their targets when over England. In FMB getting multiple flights to meet up is very hard to manage.
5. Will the AI have the sense to stop following their leader if he gets damaged and starts to lose position? Presently one only needs to hit up the leader and the rest are happy to die with him
6. Are their other maps or can this one be extended? Britain was bombed all over during the BoB, eg the Bristol based factories at Filton and Coventry in the Blitz are obvious examples.
7. When assigning escort duties for fighters can you simplify the method? Presently you have to set a target for each flight - very painful
8. Can we create our own custom columns or formations which we can save as a new object/item/template? This would be a useful feature for longer term campaigns
9. How will the points system work? Can we assign custom points values in the mission? 100 per engine and rewarding players who run off and land per kill is pretty basic and doesn't help make good missions in online squadron competition fighting such as USL (www.uslglobal.com). Please feel free check out their scoring system which makes for more realistic combat scenarios.

Others have asked my other questions, particularly about waypoint timings and groupings - many thanks if you can find time for these.
~S~