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#1
08-23-2010, 02:48 AM
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Purely out of curiosity and for my own edification, I inquire where you are from and your age. I am 41 and from the US (Maryland to be exact). Splitter 
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#3
08-23-2010, 03:08 AM
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(BTW I'm from the PRO Connecticut, so I can relate)
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#4
08-23-2010, 03:29 AM
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 . I like all that individual rights/Constitution/small government stuff. Down here we call it Marylandistan and it ain't easy living here lol.Andy: Just my own curiosity as I said. The way the US is viewed around the world is interesting to me. Like you (I am assuming here and you know how that goes) I would like the US to withdraw from world politics for a decade or so with our only demand being free flowing cheap oil. Small price to pay to make the Americans mind their own business, no? The reason I would like to see it probably differs from yours but we could agree to try it and see how it works out .PS....I am glad this discussion stayed relatively civil by internet standards. Splitter
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#5
08-23-2010, 03:53 AM
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#6
08-23-2010, 04:05 AM
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“Churchill was enthusiastic, and already saw himself with the ability to eliminate all Russia’s major industrial population centres” (Le Monde Diplomatique, August 1990).
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#7
08-23-2010, 04:17 AM
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Yes, as far as I know, the western Allies were all aware of the Manhattan project one way or another.
The US flat out told Churchill we had the bomb. The Soviets were not told so specifically, but they knew about the Manhattan project through their spy network in the States. The Communist Party was fairly large here before the war so recruits were easy to come by (nothing against the Soviets on that front, spying was just part of the game). They did not, however, think the US has developed the bomb yet. (Interestingly and as an aside, the Nazi party was also rather large before the war in the US.) In all likelihood, the Brits would have been for dropping the bomb ASAP while the Russians would have sought delay. They wanted the opportunity to capture more Japanese holdings before the war ended. The Soviets wanted free access to the Pacific and were hoping Japan would be split much like Germany had been. I am absolutely positive that future world politics was part of the decision making process for dropping the bomb. But I think the over riding factor for Truman was his responsibility (duty really) to prevent the loss of hundreds of thousands of American lives. I also think he saw that a decisive blow, as horrible as it would be, would save Japanese lives and infrastructure in the long run. As I said earlier, no one in their right minds would volunteer to make a decision like that. Even if it is the right thing, even if there was no other real choice, you would still be signing the death warrant of thousands of people. It's impossible to imagine how much that has to weigh on someone's soul. Splitter Last edited by Splitter; 08-23-2010 at 04:19 AM.
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#8
08-23-2010, 04:35 AM
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Last edited by AndyJWest; 08-23-2010 at 04:36 AM. Reason: Typo
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#9
08-23-2010, 05:32 AM
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I found this debate quite interesting. I have no problem with or without having the Nuke in game. I only play MP and doubt I would ever see it there anyways.
As far as the RL debate: I see both sides of the issue as far as the bombs being dropped. The U.S. was caught with it's pants down and a war started on a surprise Japanese military strike at Pearl. I think war is down right disturbing in the 1st place, let alone civilian casualties. But: The US asked for a conditional surrender and warned of the consequences. There was no response. A bomb was dropped. The US, again, asked for a conditional surrender. Again, no response was given. Bomb number two was dropped. If I recall correctly, a 3rd bomb was in the air/en-route when the surrender finally came through. I think the loss of life is an utter tragedy, but I also think the American people needed a surrender for the war to be over. We were struck with our pants down, with virtually no warning. The public was in an outrage. And quite honestly, when the public rises up together, the people do speak. I am in no way shape or form agreeing with the use of a nuke or killing anyone let alone innocent civilians, but I do see both sides of the argument quite well. Unless my study of history is simply "wrong", I don't think the majority of the use of the nuke fell on the hands of the US. I think this falls on the emperor of Japan's shoulders and his pride. We did what we did to finish/end the war. I honestly feel horrible even thinking about it. It's an atrocity, but it was well with a firm warning that could have been stopped. Just my .02 cents SoW, on the other hand, is coming along quite nicely. . . Cheers!
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