The real IL2 focus group (Everyone come in here)

[jt_medina]

Originally Posted by Anton Yudintsev

I suppose, there are now a lot of flight sims on a market, and everyone of othem (except ours), has red-outs?

I've never called the game anyhow, except IL-2 Sturmovik:Birds of Prey.
We are making it, you are voting for it - with your money, and your (possible) loyalty. If it is so important for you - OK, do not even try demo. Or, buy the game, and vote for blackouts in this (and others) polls - than we'll make it in sequel.

But my guess is that this feature is not what make flight sim game a real simulation. Flight sim - by definition - is the simulation of the flight, of the plane dynamics - not of the pilot's body reaction to it. Should 'real' flightsim simulate vomit on a spins as well?

For sure I´ll try the demo. But I have been a fan of the original IL2 and this BOP has part of his name. IL2 made history and I expect at least from this BOP to be as realistic as the original IL2 is.

You want to take this feature out?. Ok, But don´t expect people say that it is an ultra realistic sim. Sorry this is what ""hardcore"" simmers are gonna think, including me. Blackouts play an important role and have been included since my first 16bits simulator.

To me this lower the standar of this sim, may be after I try out the demo I will change my mind but to me and for many others fans of IL2 are gonna see this like a weird decision.

You get angry because of my comments?.
Sr, critics said politely are good to improve things. I am not being rude but just trying to let you know how important this feature for many people is.

There you have the votes of the people. is not it enough to let you know what people really want?.

[Anton Yudintsev]

Originally Posted by jt_medina

For sure I´ll try the demo. But I have been a fan of the original IL2 and this BOP has part of his name. IL2 made history and I expect at least from this BOP to be as realistic as the original IL2 is.

You know, I think I can name more inaccuarcies in physics simulation, plane characteristics, and othe details in original game, than you.
Will it make original IL-2 bad game?
Was original Il-2 a console game? Why do you want the same game on another platform at all.
Was there any console flight simulation game at all? Why?

We made a new game.
Not a direct port of original PC game to consoles. A new one.
There will be parts of better simulation than original.
There will be parts of not-as-precise simulation as original one.
Because it is another game.

Redouts and blackouts - can be cool feature. But it isn't about plane flight simulation at all. It is about _game_. You are not really suffering from redout, when game shows you red screen, aren't you? So it is not about simulation, it is about indication, gameplay.

You want to take this feature out?. Ok, But don´t expect people say that it is an ultra realistic sim.

Yeah, OK.
Call it just realistic sim, without 'ultra'. Or simply just sim.
That means - sim.

To me this lower the standar of this sim, may be after I try out the demo I will change my mind but to me and for many others fans of IL2 are gonna see this like a weird decision.

OK, then don't buy it. No pressure from me.

You get angry because of my comments?.

No. I am getting tired, but not angry.
I understand your reasons.
I know a lot about our game, and about original game. More than gamers, and more than most of developers, and even more than some of developers of original game.
The thing is - you don't understand reasons.
It is hard to make a game, that will appeal to both audience. It is hard to make game with IL-2 name and even with another publisher, for another platform.

I am not telling that I am 100% sure, that that decision was right.
But it wasn't made because we've forgotten to make it, or were too lazy, or simply haven't known that such things happen to pilots. We made this feature, presented it on events, and yet it isn't in a release build.

Ask yourself, does this feature worth, let's say, possibility of ruining sales for a title? Spoil fun in multiplayer? Sequel? Simulation mode at all? Another year of development? Releasing the game at all?

That is what we were chosen (not in that specific case, I mean in general).

There you have the votes of the people. is not it enough to let you know what people really want?.

Nope. Most people in this poll here:
* are flight sim lovers. Moreover, hardcore once, who read forum
* are not against removing this feature. They'd like to have it (so do I), but not against removing it
* do not understand the whole picture (and not prentend to).
Besides, there are only 18 of them so far. Less than focus group, or even QA team.

OK, I have an idea.
Let's stop discuss redouts for a while.
I was going to release some Q&A instead, but I think I've used all my time for a weekend.
Talk to you all next week!

[irrelevant]

Thanks for your time, Anton.

It's a shame so much effort has been, well, wasted on this topic. I, like many here, would like to see a little blackout or redout visual... but at the end of the day, I am FAR more excited about how the game will play.

I mean, seriously, the closest thing I've seen to a sim experience for consoles is Over G Fighters on the 360. I managed to entertain myself for well over a year playing that game on single player only... and there were so many elements missing from that game.

With everything the team has included in this game - the beautiful graphics, the amazing sounds (hello? the crash in that gameplay video sounded spectacular!!!), the planes, the flight models, the missions, the options, etc. - there is nothing, in my humble opinion, that will compete and I made up my mind to buy this on release day a LONG time ago.

You can take out my favorite plane, the P-51, and I will still buy this game because it looks that damn good. I haven't been this excited for a flight game on consoles ever... and why? Because no one has brought this level of realism and detail to a game thus far.

Seriously, some of this bickering needs to end. Anton comes on this forum and has dealt with the highs and lows of "I love this game" and "OMG, deal breaker!" for the simple reason of trying to keep us informed and, perhaps, appeased. He has spent A LOT of time answering our questions... more than most would for other games. Frankly, I'd rather hear some Q&A answers in the other thread... or learn about other details of the game... than read 10 responses from Anton about why blackouts and redouts aren't in the game. His first post should have been enough (at least it was for me).

Title update... next game... whatever. I'm buying this thing and I am going to have a BLAST flying around the skies for a long, long time.

Anton, enjoy your weekend.

[GabeFan]

Originally Posted by irrelevant

Thanks for your time, Anton.

It's a shame so much effort has been, well, wasted on this topic. I, like many here, would like to see a little blackout or redout visual... but at the end of the day, I am FAR more excited about how the game will play.

I mean, seriously, the closest thing I've seen to a sim experience for consoles is Over G Fighters on the 360. I managed to entertain myself for well over a year playing that game on single player only... and there were so many elements missing from that game.

With everything the team has included in this game - the beautiful graphics, the amazing sounds (hello? the crash in that gameplay video sounded spectacular!!!), the planes, the flight models, the missions, the options, etc. - there is nothing, in my humble opinion, that will compete and I made up my mind to buy this on release day a LONG time ago.

You can take out my favorite plane, the P-51, and I will still buy this game because it looks that damn good. I haven't been this excited for a flight game on consoles ever... and why? Because no one has brought this level of realism and detail to a game thus far.

Seriously, some of this bickering needs to end. Anton comes on this forum and has dealt with the highs and lows of "I love this game" and "OMG, deal breaker!" for the simple reason of trying to keep us informed and, perhaps, appeased. He has spent A LOT of time answering our questions... more than most would for other games. Frankly, I'd rather hear some Q&A answers in the other thread... or learn about other details of the game... than read 10 responses from Anton about why blackouts and redouts aren't in the game. His first post should have been enough (at least it was for me).

Title update... next game... whatever. I'm buying this thing and I am going to have a BLAST flying around the skies for a long, long time.

Anton, enjoy your weekend.

+1!
VERY well said "irrelevant"!!!

[Buggins]

Originally Posted by Anton Yudintsev

OK, I have an idea.
Let's stop discuss redouts for a while.
I was going to release some Q&A instead, but I think I've used all my time for a weekend.
Talk to you all next week!

Happy Guiltyspark? Anton has been so patient with your bullshit, now you've ruined it for the rest of us. Just don't buy the game and piss off.

[peterdegrotere]

stop bitching guys, some of you are crossing the line, if its up to me..., you have your thougts abouth things, oke thats cool, but what i see here ?the attack on anton, he told you whats the reason was and there will be no changes, he kept it in a nice way and took the trouble for uss, to let uss know whats going on behind closed doors, and some of you are bitching him off.
Im not gonna go in any discussion with you, but you know if your the one to be a shamed of yourself

[jt_medina]

Originally Posted by peterdegrotere

stop bitching guys, some of you are crossing the line, if its up to me..., you have your thougts abouth things, oke thats cool, but what i see here ?the attack on anton, he told you whats the reason was and there will be no changes, he kept it in a nice way and took the trouble for uss, to let uss know whats going on behind closed doors, and some of you are bitching him off.
Im not gonna go in any discussion with you, but you know if your the one to be a shamed of yourself

I am not attacking anyone, just expresing my concerns about such important feature to me. I want this sim to become as realistically as possible and in my opinion like the 99% of sim fans is that blackouts have been a feature since the very first simulators.

But don´t be wrong, I am not offending anyone or crossing any line but just expressing my concerns. That´s all.
And I still think that this decision is a big mistake.

[peterdegrotere]

Originally Posted by jt_medina

I am not attacking anyone, just expresing my concerns about such important feature to me. I want this sim to become as realistically as possible and in my opinion like the 99% of sim fans is that blackouts have been a feature since the very first simulators.

But don´t be wrong, I am not offending anyone or crossing any line but just expressing my concerns. That´s all.
And I still think that this decision is a big mistake.

if you think your one of them, because your reacting you know enough,if not than not, i thought i wrote this also for another post, but that has to been removed or changed now, i just cant stand that people are so not human..i mean a guy (anton) that helps us fly,nerds giving information,.. and if people dont like the answer they start bitching, and starting a useless discussion ..come on guys, i know there are some good fans, maybe the what older guys with more sense that like the effort anton makes, i mean he can let us swim in the water without any information.you can discus thinks thats no problem that what forums are for, but please thread people with a bit of respect you'll
greetz me

[P-51]

We realy need to give anton some respect, you are all acting like babies. Im 15 and seem to have a greater apreciation of what anton dose than most of you! Now I for one would have prefered Q&A to this obsessive whining.
Chris

[jt_medina]

Originally Posted by peterdegrotere

if you think your one of them, because your reacting you know enough,if not than not, i thought i wrote this also for another post, but that has to been removed or changed now, i just cant stand that people are so not human..i mean a guy (anton) that helps us fly,nerds giving information,.. and if people dont like the answer they start bitching, and starting a useless discussion ..come on guys, i know there are some good fans, maybe the what older guys with more sense that like the effort anton makes, i mean he can let us swim in the water without any information.you can discus thinks thats no problem that what forums are for, but please thread people with a bit of respect you'll
greetz me

Bitching??!!!!, are you out of your mind!!??.

Can´t I disagree with the opinion of a poster???, I just said my personal opinion, never insulted anyone, never said this BOP is garbage, I just said that the lack of blackouts is a MISTAKE like many people who are in the simulation business for sure are gonna think.

If you don´t like hear critics close this forum.

Man I think you have to take things easy. Relax guy, seriously!. You are twisting things in a non sense.