Stunning NEW pics

[Skii]

Originally Posted by Marchochias

Now cmon, there were twenty four variants of the Spitfire alone. The differences between most of them were so minor as to be insignificant. If it wasn't a major change to the engine, armament or airframe, who cares, honestly?

At some point, you have to say "ok, that is a spitfire with X engine and X armament" rather than "Hey, they didn't have 2 .303s in 1941, that was only in 1942!"

It's basically the equivalent of complaining in a warfare game about a Panzer IV being Ausf G when in fact only Ausf As were available at that particular month or something. Meaningless quibbling, in short

No disrepect, but at the very least the key ingredients for a Battle of Britain experience is the right planes, and a Spit Mk1 is one of them. Now I'm not complaining, but I have to admit to being a little dissapointed if the key aircraft in the Battle of Britain campaign are the wrong type.

Forgive me, I'm British, and aircraft nut and I'm passionate about our finest hour, pumping cannon shells into Heinkels over the docklands just won't feel right

[philip.ed]

Originally Posted by Skii

No disrepect, but at the very least the key ingredients for a Battle of Britain experience is the right planes, and a Spit Mk1 is one of them. Now I'm not complaining, but I have to admit to being a little dissapointed if the key aircraft in the Battle of Britain campaign are the wrong type.

Forgive me, I'm British, and aircraft nut and I'm passionate about our finest hour, pumping cannon shells into Heinkels over the docklands just won't feel right

Completely agree. Also, the difference between cannons and machine guns is staggering. I can live with the Hurricane in game, but literally blowing apart a heinkill with a 2 second burst from a spitfire mark Vb just won't feel right, as skii said, and it won't be realistic for the battle of britain. My opinion may sound as though I'm knitpicking, but I don't think it's an easy mistake to make..far from it. All you need to do is wiki search battle of britain, and the info on planes used will be there.

[Marchochias]

That's my point. The guys making this game obviously know rather a lot about aircraft, and even if they didn't, a 2 minute search on wikipedia would tell them about even the most obscure aircraft variants.

These models and textures take a hell of a lot of time and money to create. They obviously choose very carefully exactly what kind of aircraft they want to make a model of. And for whatever reason, they chose these ones.

Remember, singleplayer isn't their only consideration. They probably want to have the Spitfires and Hurricanes balanced nicely with the Bf 109 for multiplayer, and if the Bf 109 has a cannon armament and the British planes don't, that could be a big problem.

Either way, remember that this is a flight sim, not a time machine. Shooting down He 111s over the channel isn't going to feel quite right, because you're sitting in a couch looking at at TV screen rather than flying the real thing.

[Anton Yudintsev]

Originally Posted by Marchochias

That's my point. The guys making this game obviously know rather a lot about aircraft, and even if they didn't, a 2 minute search on wikipedia would tell them about even the most obscure aircraft variants.

These models and textures take a hell of a lot of time and money to create. They obviously choose very carefully exactly what kind of aircraft they want to make a model of. And for whatever reason, they chose these ones.

Remember, singleplayer isn't their only consideration. They probably want to have the Spitfires and Hurricanes balanced nicely with the Bf 109 for multiplayer, and if the Bf 109 has a cannon armament and the British planes don't, that could be a big problem.

Either way, remember that this is a flight sim, not a time machine. Shooting down He 111s over the channel isn't going to feel quite right, because you're sitting in a couch looking at at TV screen rather than flying the real thing.

Thanks for support - and you are right in most of your suggestions, including the one about time machine.
It is literally impossible to reproduce some of a differences between planes.
For example, in Mig plane, if plane goes to nose-diving canopy blocked, and pilot wasn't able to bail out, leading to death. That's why they flew with canopy opened, so the speed was lower, but it was safer, so texhnical limit wasn't achieved.
La-5 has an awful exhausting, and the temperature was 55-60 degrees (celsium) - making maneuvering harder for pilot. How it can be reproduced in the game?
I am not planes specialist, neither historical consultant, not British, and not responsible for planes in any aspect. Actually, I am not even PM of a project. But we are working with historical consultants, and if team have chosen one or other modification (even if it was actually unpopular, rare, or has some obvious disadvantages which were omitted) - than they had reasons for doing that.
The game, even flight sim game, is NOT encyclopedia by any means. It has to provide fun. If one plane is obviously 100% worser than all other planes in all realism settings and all multiplayer mode, controlling by AI or even novice players - than probably this plane should be replaced with its better modification, especially if we need this plane for specific campaign.

Even educational and documentary(!) films, have some certain mistakes, and nobody complains about that.
Most famous 'Battle for Britain' or 'Attack on Pearl Harbour', which are feature films, have a lot of mistakes - and still are great movies.

Sorry for being so lengthy, but it was one of our main headache - how much close to reality should we stay.
Sales and ratings willl show were we right

[philip.ed]

Originally Posted by Anton Yudintsev

Thanks for support - and you are right in most of your suggestions, including the one about time machine.
It is literally impossible to reproduce some of a differences between planes.
For example, in Mig plane, if plane goes to nose-diving canopy blocked, and pilot wasn't able to bail out, leading to death. That's why they flew with canopy opened, so the speed was lower, but it was safer, so texhnical limit wasn't achieved.
La-5 has an awful exhausting, and the temperature was 55-60 degrees (celsium) - making maneuvering harder for pilot. How it can be reproduced in the game?
I am not planes specialist, neither historical consultant, not British, and not responsible for planes in any aspect. Actually, I am not even PM of a project. But we are working with historical consultants, and if team have chosen one or other modification (even if it was actually unpopular, rare, or has some obvious disadvantages which were omitted) - than they had reasons for doing that.
The game, even flight sim game, is NOT encyclopedia by any means. It has to provide fun. If one plane is obviously 100% worser than all other planes in all realism settings and all multiplayer mode, controlling by AI or even novice players - than probably this plane should be replaced with its better modification, especially if we need this plane for specific campaign.

Even educational and documentary(!) films, have some certain mistakes, and nobody complains about that.
Most famous 'Battle for Britain' or 'Attack on Pearl Harbour', which are feature films, have a lot of mistakes - and still are great movies.

Sorry for being so lengthy, but it was one of our main headache - how much close to reality should we stay.
Sales and ratings willl show were we right

I understand what you are saying Anton, and I am not trying to be negative, as I understand that both the spit and hurricane models in game came during the latter half of the BoB. However, having the correct models would really make this game that much more realistic; i mean, it is a simulation
On the other hand, as you said, the historical consultants must have had a reason for including whatever models they did. In my opinion, they just used the existing models from il-2 1946 but correct me if I am wrong

At the end of the day, i know you will do a superb job, but I just wanted to bring this to your attention. Maybe you could include the earlier model spit and hurris in a seperate dowload pack...although this would be a lot of work.

Sorry if I sound negative, really I am not. I just find that when doing a simulation, everything needs to be as realistic as possible. I would like to add that if you included the correct BoB skins for these aircraft, then that in my opinion would make this game something special. The skins that I have seen have been from the later period after the battle of britain, and so aren't historically correct. Such a change could have a dramatic effect

[Anton Yudintsev]

Originally Posted by philip.ed

In my opinion, they just used the existing models from il-2 1946 but correct me if I am wrong

You are wrong

[irrelevant]

Originally Posted by Anton Yudintsev

You are wrong

Haha!

[Marchochias]

Originally Posted by Anton Yudintsev

You are wrong

That's what I said, only with pretty pictures haha.

[philip.ed]

Originally Posted by Anton Yudintsev

You are wrong

Good!

However, I still think that having the 100% correct aircraft would make this game that much more better.

[SlappyDingle]

Well Marcho, as I'm sure you've read, we all care a great deal about the details. We don't need the Spits and Hurris balanced nicely with the BF109. That's Heroes Over Europe talk! Seriously tho, if they have all the little pros and cons they had in real life, the balance will be there.