SOW: your thoughts on clickable cockpits and realistic start-up

[Rama]

Since this is an oppinion thread, I will give mine.

I don't care about clickable pits as long I'm not obliged to use them (as long there's no interference with the views and no other losses).
That's said, I don't see the need of it (except to satisfy some peoples that "think" it's more realistic)... good for them if they feel satisfied (but not to the detriment of others)

Originally Posted by TX-EcoDragon

and most all flight sim pilots with experience outside the rather limited world of IL-2 appreciate the need for a cockpit interface that is more than just a facade.

Sorry, but that's quite wrong. I know many RL pilots (both civilian, amateurs or pro and military) who play with IL2, and also with FSX, and who don't care and don't use clickable cockpits.
I understand that some do... but it's far to be generalizes as you pretend.

Those that want to map everything to their joystick can do so (despite the fact that's not at all realistic)

That's not less realistic than using the mouse to select and click a button or a lever on the pit...
I agree that hud messages are immersion killers, but they can be removed without clickable pits... as long the corresponding virtual pit switch or lever or indicator is correctly animated and displayed.
when piloting a plane in RL, I never search and click a button with a mouse... most of the time I don't even look at it... and that's the case for most of the pilots, even more when they are experienced. the pilot as to use all is attention to outside view and instrument, and this is even more important (especially for outside view) for military pilots.
So using buttons on HOTAS, even if the buttons are not on the "right place" (except for pit builders), when it becomes instinctive, is certainly closer to "reality" than looking at the button position, moving the mouse on the button and clicking.

If you want clickeable pits for your satisfaction, I can understand that... and as I said earlier, I have no problems for clickable pit lovers to be satisfied... but please don't justify them with "realism". It's a nonsense and IMHO destroy your argumentation so don't help you to obtain what you want.

[jasonbirder]

Right...we know that many people don't like the idea of a clickpit INTERFACE but thats not important...any clickable input would have a keyboard shortcut and be mapable anyway...
The point is do people want the FUNCTIONALITY that it would bring?
IE realistic, non-generic, high workload engine, fuel and flight systems to monitor and manage (ideally with corresponding problems/failures etc) alongside a realistic navigation and communication environment...
I guess what we are asking for is a realistic world war 2 combat flight SIMULATOR
And the like/dislike discussion of the relative merits of the clickpit interface is taking away from that...

[JVM]

Originally Posted by jasonbirder

IE realistic, non-generic, high workload engine, fuel and flight systems to monitor and manage (ideally with corresponding problems/failures etc) alongside a realistic navigation and communication environment...
I guess what we are asking for is a realistic world war 2 combat flight SIMULATOR

So it is not really about clickable cockpit at all, but really CEM...However one of the issues is: if you make a mistake in your CEM leading you to, say, an engine failure enroute to the mission target, how fun will it be to have to crash-land/bail out without having done nothing? At a minimum you would need to have instantly the choice to join as an observer (or actor if you can replace an AI player) in another aircraft of the mission, wouldn't you?

Besides, for for a TrackIR user a good implementation of a kind of clickable cockpit would be the ability to assign a "cockpit" button on either stick or throttle (or whatever!): when you look with the trackIR in the cockpit, if the button is pressed the control/button in the focal point of the view is (kind of) highlighted; when you release the button, the control changes states with the required animation and configuration.
The advantage here is you would have nearly the same instantaneity as if you where activating said control with your finger without loosing your time and awareness trying to point it with a mouse...
Drawback is the need for a TrackIR (or equivalent device) and it would not work very well with "analog" controls (like trims for instance) which are usually controlled by feeling/evaluating the induced effect...

JV