Friday the 14th Development Update

[ATAG_Snapper]

Caveat emptor.

[gec]

i have to say that i'm very disappointed.

The game was released and sold as a product while it was just a half a product. Few patches released did not rise it to the product it should be.

Now, to get a product i all ready payed for i need to buy more?

that's maybe called business in Russia but in the rest of the world that's called fraud.

[JtD]

Originally Posted by Tree_UK

Glad you find it funny, but I suspect because of the awful mess that is CLOD and the amount of time it has taken to still not fix it, and the missing features and the dumbing down of graphics, the poor netcode, the lack of coop's, poor campaign's, the broken GUI in single player etc etc, that the sales of the sequel will reflect what I consider to be rather shoddy treatment from the dev's. If you consider the above to be good for business then you are deluded.

Not good for business, but beats out of business.

I think the sales of the sequel will mostly reflect that they go back to the Eastern front, cater the home market, which is what made Il-2 successful in the first place. If they get it right that time, all the trouble with CloD won't matter much. Commercially. And that's why luthier has no options but to meet the deadlines.

[HamishUK]

Was it going to be any other way?

What an absolute car-crash of a release over a year ago....

That's me done with 1C. Shame as the community is so passionate about aircraft and yet for some reason 1C could not do something easy as follow up on a success story that was IL2....it baffles the mind.

[Frequent_Flyer]

Originally Posted by Tree_UK

Glad you find it funny, but I suspect because of the awful mess that is CLOD and the amount of time it has taken to still not fix it, and the missing features and the dumbing down of graphics, the poor netcode, the lack of coop's, poor campaign's, the broken GUI in single player etc etc, that the sales of the sequel will reflect what I consider to be rather shoddy treatment from the dev's. If you consider the above to be good for business then you are deluded.

Every point you make is valid and accurate. However, the only real way any change will be affected is if there was a competing product.At this point in time there is no other option for the paying customer to support.

[BH_woodstock]

Originally Posted by Tree_UK

You forgot a very important part of running a business here Luthier, you missed out the word 'CUSTOMERS'. After selling us this product with no mention of any of the problems that you were fully aware of you should put your CUSTOMERS before anything else. You have failed to do that in my honest opinion, your priority for the last 18 months should have been all hands on deck fixing what you sold us rather than concentrating on your next money making scheme.

well said.I feel used and cheated.You promised us a game and we took the bait based on il2's past history.You then took a beautiful sim and ruined it and promising us a fix it all this time and knowing it would never happen.Shame on you.you cannot sell a product and then say we will fix it if you buy the next version.that is poppycock.


since you guys have not kept ONE promise. and not fixed anything.How about releasing the tools so we can do it ourselves.(this was also promised by Oleg himself)He said the tools will be released.There are guys here that can fix this game (modding community)So with that being said...Thanks for nothing.Do the right thing and release the tools so the game will be fixed.Be honorable after all that is what this community is based on we should except nothing less.

i will buy the next version only because i am still hopeful.but i still feel jipped.

[broken pixel]

Originally Posted by Tree_UK

You forgot a very important part of running a business here Luthier, you missed out the word 'CUSTOMERS'. After selling us this product with no mention of any of the problems that you were fully aware of you should put your CUSTOMERS before anything else. You have failed to do that in my honest opinion, your priority for the last 18 months should have been all hands on deck fixing what you sold us rather than concentrating on your next money making scheme.

These days "THE CUSTOMER" does not mean crap to company's or corporations. It is all about the almighty investors, sad days man, sad days.

[mazex]

Originally Posted by Tree_UK

You forgot a very important part of running a business here Luthier, you missed out the word 'CUSTOMERS'. After selling us this product with no mention of any of the problems that you were fully aware of you should put your CUSTOMERS before anything else. You have failed to do that in my honest opinion, your priority for the last 18 months should have been all hands on deck fixing what you sold us rather than concentrating on your next money making scheme.

C'mon Tree It's simply impossible that you work in the private sector of what the rest of us call "the economy"? Basically it's about the fact that if your company does not make a profit it gets shut down... Fast.

So - who would put up the money to have the team working on patching a product for 18 months that unfortunately must have been a financial fiasco? 1C? Ubisoft? Just get over it, CloD was a failure - both financially and technically. End of story. Now they have actually spent too much time trying to get it right as they are naturally embarrassed that some bean counter forced them to release it while the engineers with Oleg at the helm most certainly wanted to do a second (or third) restart of the project with a new engine... Which was naturally impossible after that last managed code experiment that failed...

A pillar of the market economy is that you don't throw good money after bad. The only reason we have gotten patches the last 18 months is that Ilya and "the new" team convinced someone with money that they could do a sequel based on the failed project to get some money back from that seven year investment. The financier probably realized that even if a sequel was successful, they would never get all the money back for the previous seven years. As they don't live in Northern Korea they know the meaning of "sunk costs" and agreed to finance the development of a sequel anyway, as the costs to have the team running another 2.5 years would be smaller than the expected revenue from the sequel (keeping in mind that they did not start from zero). Ilya probably had to get a new suit for these meetings and certainly got some milestones set that they had to deliver along the project time line or the money tap would get shut down at any point...

I really would like the CloD we all dreamed of, but we have to to accept the fact that it will not happen. Every hour spent patching CloD that does not benefit the sequel increases the risk that MG will have to pick down the sign next year (or this year if they don't show good progress). That sequel has to get decent reviews at least and sell a couple of hundred thousand copies. That's the only way we will ever see a FW 190 in the future in this engine...

And no, the argument that they have to fix CloD or no one will buy the sequel is naturally bull. If the sequel hits the market next fall and gets reviews in the > 80% range every single one of the customers that bought CloD will buy it as we there are only 1-2 decent simulators released every year. We are not that many anyway - so it's the ones that did NOT buy CloD that they need to get green figures at the bottom line

EDIT: The ones we have a right to be pissed at are the publishers 1C/(Ubisoft) - that actually released the game to the market in the state it was, I don't hold MG responsible for that bad decision at all... But - if it was that or nothing I must say that I've had quite some fun with CloD anyway that definitely makes up for my $39.

[ChicoMick]

What I don't understand is this. If the Sequel has the power to 'update/fix' clod in the future then why can't those fixes still be available as 'stand alone' patches? ie without the BoM maps missions and planes ? Then we can decide whether we want the sequel or not.

I don't especially want to fight on the russian front.

I guess this doesn't fit the business plan.....

[icarus]

Originally Posted by ChicoMick

What I don't understand is this. If the Sequel has the power to 'update/fix' clod in the future then why can't those fixes still be available as 'stand alone' patches? ie without the BoM maps missions and planes ? Then we can decide whether we want the sequel or not.

I don't especially want to fight on the russian front.

I guess this doesn't fit the business plan.....

+1

There is no reason they cannot do that. The only reason to do it the other way is to extract more cash unethically like bait and switch. Perhaps they will have a change of heart.