Stability and Control characteristics of the Early Mark Spitfires

[Glider]

Originally Posted by robtek

There might be hundreds of Spitfires being lost over sea or behind enemy lines because of mishandling in stress situations, all disregarded because being accorded to enemy action.
Nobody knows that for sure.
The only data we have is a per se incomplete list of researched accidents.

As probably 90% of Mk I and Mk II combats were over the UK I doubt that hundreds were lost behind enemy lines or over the sea. So the comment about a lack of examples is a valid one.

One has been identified in volved in a spin. Crumpps comment was typical The never changed it because a high speed dive is generally the result of spin recovery and a Spitfire pilot could break the airplane rather easilyThe fact that this example was in a high speed dive from low cloud, then did a violent pull up presumably to avoid hitting the ground, suffered a high speed stall, then spun and then had a wing failure tells me that it was far from easy to break a Spitfire wing. It was very difficult.

Edit - I should add that to say that a high speed dive is generally the result of a spin recovery is rubbish, any pilot with spin experience would know that. In combat a high speed dive is normally the result of combat, trying to evade or bounce an enemy aircraft. Spinning is slow speed activity and recovering doesn't take long you have to wait until you have sufficient speed. Its the wait that is often the more dangerous time as if you try to pull out with insufficient speed the plane tends to sink (often called mush)and can still hit the ground. Holding your nerve until speed has been reached with the ground coming up can be difficult for some pilots to learn.
If you are in a high speed spin you are normally dead whatever happens to the plane as you will be trapped by the G forces, unable to open the cockpit or get out

[Crumpp]

150 mph, in a vertikal dive, with a GRADUALLY recovery, surely you'll reach a pretty high velocity before leveling out, accelerating all the time.

Exactly.

Your thrust vector adds to gravity, lift opposes drag <unless you dive a zero lift angle>

In short, away you go...

in an aerobatic plane.

Like the one in my hanger???

That passenger is Col. Phil Lacey.

The Fitzpatrick Custom was just a dream in 1947 when a former World War II fighter pilot, Phil Lacey, showed his friend Al Fitzpatrick some of his car sketches.

Read more: http://www.autoweek.com/article/2006...#ixzz22txOQq1j

Col. Lacey flew P-40's, P-39's, and P51's with the 8th USAAF in World War II. In Korea he flew F-86's and Vietnam, Canberra bombers.

You don't what aerobatics is until you seen Phil take the stick, LOL. That old man can fly the paint off an airplane.

And yes, he reads and abides by the Operating Notes.....

[Crumpp]

I should add that to say that a high speed dive is generally the result of a spin recovery is rubbish

Read the Operating Notes.....

150 mph, in a vertikal dive

BTW, you are not necessarily going to be vertical nor is certain you will enter a high speed dive.

There is a good possibility of that happening.

[IvanK]

I have a set of Orange covered Spitfire MKIIA notes (Paper reprint) that bear little resemblance to the ones in SCRIBD.

As was discussed in this "Thread that never ends" in the set I have Spinning was permitted if pilots were authorised by the CO or CFI at the OTU level. The Scribd ones say deliberate spinning was prohibited.

So two references with opposed statements.

[IvanK]

Originally Posted by Crumpp
The aircraft's reaction to gun recoil could also be modeled. As an unstable platform, the arm is shorter which means less resistance to motion.


Cough If you actually flew the sim you would see it is modelled !

[ATAG_Dutch]

Originally Posted by IvanK

Cough If you actually flew the sim you would see it is modelled !

And there's the rub.