Speed graphs for Spitfire and Hurricane

[Insuber]

In terms of performance I find also the Bf-110 C-7 a bit too slow. I can't exceed 420-430 Km/h @ s.l., no payload, with 50% fuel, rads full open. From the Internet I find for the C-4 (same DB 601N 1200 hp engines, theconly difference being the bomb racks):

Bf 110C-4 - Maximum Speed: 294mph (473km/h) at sea level, 349mph (561km/h) at 7,000 metres (22,965 feet)
Cruise Speed: 217-262mph (349-422km/h)
Time to 5,500 metres (18,045 feet): 8 minutes
Service Ceiling: 9,754 metres (32,000 feet)
Range: 565 miles (909 kilometres)

Source:

www.airgalore.co.uk/vault/bf110.html

Cheers!

[ATAG_Snapper]

Originally Posted by Insuber

In terms of performance I find also the Bf-110 C-7 a bit too slow. I can't exceed 420-430 Km/h @ s.l., no payload, with 50% fuel, rads full open. From the Internet I find for the C-4 (same DB 601N 1200 hp engines, theconly difference being the bomb racks):

Bf 110C-4 - Maximum Speed: 294mph (473km/h) at sea level, 349mph (561km/h) at 7,000 metres (22,965 feet)
Cruise Speed: 217-262mph (349-422km/h)
Time to 5,500 metres (18,045 feet): 8 minutes
Service Ceiling: 9,754 metres (32,000 feet)
Range: 565 miles (909 kilometres)

Source:

www.airgalore.co.uk/vault/bf110.html

Cheers!

That's not good. I have no hard data in front of me, but my impressions of the 110 are that if it jettisons its load it was tough for RAF fighter to catch. And if they did it it was no pushover -- it had huge firepower (including a rear gunner) and speed, but not as maneuverable as a single seat fighter.

Sounds like the 110, as modelled in this sim, should be 40 - 50 kmh faster at sea level.

[Kwiatek]

Originally Posted by Insuber

In terms of performance I find also the Bf-110 C-7 a bit too slow. I can't exceed 420-430 Km/h @ s.l., no payload, with 50% fuel, rads full open. From the Internet I find for the C-4 (same DB 601N 1200 hp engines, theconly difference being the bomb racks):

Bf 110C-4 - Maximum Speed: 294mph (473km/h) at sea level, 349mph (561km/h) at 7,000 metres (22,965 feet)
Cruise Speed: 217-262mph (349-422km/h)
Time to 5,500 metres (18,045 feet): 8 minutes
Service Ceiling: 9,754 metres (32,000 feet)
Range: 565 miles (909 kilometres)

Source:

www.airgalore.co.uk/vault/bf110.html

Cheers!

Dont think such suorce is reliable for Bf 110 C-4 both for ground level speed and FTH speed.

Look here:



and here

[Insuber]

Thank you Kwiatek.

BTW, I've tested on ATAG the story that the Emil now turns inside Spits: it's not true, from my humble point of view.

I got behind a Spit IIa while on my E-4, and when he turned I tried to follow it on purpose. Well, despite I'm not a novice 109 pilot, Pomidor303 was in an advantage position scoring hits in less than 2 turns, and then only some scissors and the low light of the dawn saved me.

Ah BTW the sound radar is still there, when reds canopies are open


Cheers!

[Kwiatek]

Unfortunately still besides Spitfire MK II ( 87 octan version) most fighters are off in speed performance. British fighters are even lack in speed for 87 octan version - the most hurted now is Hurricane. Im not sure - didnt check before beta patch but it seemed for me that Hurricane was more accurate then now. Just 109 E was too slow.

So i think 1C has still a lot work to do here.

The same like with some flying characterstisic of some planes.

Example im sure that 109 E slats open at too low speed at too low angle of attack. In straight fly with idle power slats open below 150 km/h when it should open according to British test at 111 mph/180 km/h ASI.

[Insuber]

Originally Posted by Kwiatek

Dont think such suorce is reliable for Bf 110 C-4 both for ground level speed and FTH speed.

Look here:



and here

Your first graph refers to the DB 601A, with some 100 hp less IIRC. Speed at s.l. matches the C-7 in-game, but the latter has a DB601N rated at 1200 hp. The second graph is just an estimate based on the "drag and power". It gives only 3-4 km/h more to the C-7 against the C-1/2 for 9% more power ... just 1% more speed ... not a great interpolation imho ...

[Kwiatek]

Originally Posted by Insuber

Your first graph refers to the DB 601A, with some 100 hp less IIRC. Speed at s.l. matches the C-7 in-game, but the latter has a DB601N rated at 1200 hp. The second graph is just an estimate based on the "drag and power". It gives only 3-4 km/h more to the C-7 against the C-1/2 for 9% more power ... just 1% more speed ... not a great interpolation imho ...

Well it is more complicated that you think

You need to compare power curves for both 601A and 601N etc. Also i dont know what engine is used for 109 C in game. Most 110 C used Db601 engine and some used 601N but what i remember there were jabo version with bomb racks which cut some speed expecially at low alts ( with densy air). 601N had more adventage at high alts over 601A then at lower alts.

[Insuber]

Originally Posted by Kwiatek

Well it is more complicated that you think

You need to compare power curves for both 601A and 601N etc. Also i dont know what engine is used for 109 C in game. Most 110 C used Db601 engine and some used 601N but what i remember there were jabo version with bomb racks which cut some speed expecially at low alts ( with densy air). 601N had more adventage at high alts over 601A then at lower alts.

Eheheh I'm an engineer by education I'm more complicate than you think

I refer to the C-7 variant, which should be entirely equipped with the 1200 hp DB601N, three/blade propeller, rising the payload from 500 kg to 1000 kg (two 500 kg bombs).

Given that the speed / drag relationship is quadratic, and the thrust / speed is *broadly speaking* cubic, I doubt that 9% more power gives only <1% more speed. But I can be wrong ...

[Kwiatek]

You have to note that from calculated speed graph for different 110 C variants yellow curve is for 601N 30-minut engine power and grey curve is for 601A 5-minut emergency power

[Insuber]

Originally Posted by Kwiatek

You have to note that from calculated speed graph for different 110 C variants yellow curve is for 601N 30-minut engine power and grey curve is for 601A 5-minut emergency power

Then I notice also that the first graph, taken from the 110 HandBuch, which should be the DB601A at normal boost, shows the same performance for the C-1 of the grey curve in the second graph, which is the DB601A with emergency power. I see another contradiction here of the interpolated curves, don't you think so?