.50 cal?

[Jughead]

I've noticed the 50's on the bombers are quite a bit more powerful than than the ones on the fighters. I get hit with one bullet from a bomber and my plane is useless. Not the case at all when they come from fighters.

[robtek]

@jughead

well, that is so because usually when you attack a bomber you and the bullets have opposite flight-paths, not so when the guy on your six is firing at you.

afaik

[*Buzzsaw*]

Originally Posted by Jughead

I've noticed the 50's on the bombers are quite a bit more powerful than than the ones on the fighters. I get hit with one bullet from a bomber and my plane is useless. Not the case at all when they come from fighters.

Even more the case in regards to the light MG's firing from bombers. They are amazingly deadly...

The ability of all AI gunners in IL-2 to place a 'magic' bullet in exactly the right spot is a little overdone to put it mildly.

Unfortunately Oleg has not simulated the effects of G forces on AI gunners in IL-2, so for example you get situations whereby a enemy bomber which has had its wing cut off, and which is spinning towards earth at high speeds, yet can still kill you with an AI gunner firing from the rear position, even though in real life that gunner would be so thrown around by G forces that he couldn't even hang on to the gun, let alone take an aimed shot.

Also, rear gunners were very vulnerable to being killed by fire, yet in 1 on 1 duels with fighters, you can put hundreds of rounds into a gunner's position, but your chances of a kill are very small and in most situations, a duel between a fighter equipped with 4 cannon, and a rear gunner equipped with a single LMG, sees the Fighter lose.

Hopefully we don't see the same thing in BoB, AI gunners should be basically prohibited from firing when a Bomber or attack aircraft is performing high G maneuvers, and the overall accuracy of them should be toned down considerably.

Historically bomber gunners fired from aircraft which flew straight and level, yet even in those situations, accuracy was very poor. Bombers depended on massed firepower from the hundreds of guns in bomber formation. If you program the types of formations seen in the real Battle of Britain or Battle of Germany in the IL-2 game, its almost suicide for a fighter to attack.

[Mysticpuma]

I posted this a while back on the Ubi Forums. Basically the only way to get the .50 Cal to work is:

"To be honest I have also been in the "The .50's are porked" Brigade, but then I started watching my tracks back.

At times when I was sure I'd waited for the correct moment to open fire, when the enemy was filling the gunsight, I'd open fire and watch as my multiple hits did barely any damage and the 190 and 109 would turn onto me until I was dead!

How could this be, "the .50's are porked!" I'd shout, and , well, no they aren't!

I watched my tracks back and was amazed to see my bullets converging about 40-50 metres short of the target, and while 2-3 would hit (giving speckled debris), most of them had spread out way before hitting my intended target and gone either side. However, my initial burst, while inflicting little damage, had alerted the pilot of the EA...and he was off before I could actually take him down.

This is where you need (if you want the best from the .50-cals) to spend a little time, to make a lot of difference.

Set up a mission off-line, and to make it easier you can create a single mission with a friendly aircraft flying in a straight line and you are a separate flight (so it doesn't manoeuvre with you) . Now sneak up on the friendly plane as it flies straight and level and imagining it's an enemy plane get to the point where you would normally shoot. Ok, unleash your guns and then stop the mission and play back the track (of course you can play against an enemy for realism!).

So watch the track and as you fire pause the playback. Hit the F2 key and go outside the plane to the point here the bullets are converging (not hitting the plane (unless you are spot-on with your attempt)).

So now you can see where they are converging you can then start to work out of you need to set your convergence further or shorter than you have it now.
For example your convergence is 300m for both Cannons and MG. You look at the paused track and see that the bullets are crossing approx. 100-metres ahead of the EA (or friendly drone as you created that mission ). So now go back to your arming screen and decrease the convergence to 200m and replay the mission. Trial and error will get you to your sweet spot and then you will see what the .50-cal can do.

So what did I do after reviewing my tracks? Well I was set at 300 and 275 but now I have changed my settings to 200MG and 200C (even though they are all 50's!).

My first three sorties out were a revelation.
Destroyed were 3x190's and 1x109 on my first sortie.Second Sortie 2x190 1x190 and 1xJU-88 (head-on PK attack) and the Third Sortie 2x109's and another JU-88 along with 2x109's damaged while attacking a friendly.

All I'd say is set your convergence, watch your tracks and then post that the .50's are porked.....they're not...and I used to believe they were.

Now Armour Piercing incendiary in the load-outs on the Extra Ammunition as a sub-setting would be the best addition to the P-47 series since it was introduced...but the only reason I mention it is because this is a wish list for 4.09....so .50's porked....Nah!

Hope that helps, cheers, MP.

[Kwiatek]

I usually use 175m convergence for 0,50cal and still it hasn't impact for hiting to target from six o clock (expecially Fw190 but 109 also). If i hit from some delfection is big difference but shoting from rear to fuselage is mostly wasting ammo. 0,50 cal should easly penetrate fusalage and plate armour with suche angle ( 90 deg=0 deg) and wounded or kill pilot.