A request for more features to make IL-2 a better game, not just better software.

[ATAG_Bliss]

Originally Posted by KG26_Alpha

One problem is CoD has no live online community, Hyperlobby still supports all those that make it to IL2 1946 and get online via HL.

HL supports CoD but there's no huge attraction until the squads become more active.

In fact I have helped CoD pilots in HL's IL2 lobby before and plenty of casual pilots gather there.


The FMB interface is almost identical to the old one, the problem is understanding the C# features and why they went that way.

99% mission builders can handle the CoD FMB
1% can handle the scripts.





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Well, HL will come when the game is fixed. Servers like ours have soo many variables to look for to keep automatically running 24/7 that to add another program into the loop atm would be a royal PITA atm.

If we can make it stable, we'd be using HL too. But there's no point until the game gets there in the 1st place.

As far as the FMB, it's very similar. And there isn't a single thing you can't do in the FMB (besides the broken stuff) compared to the old game that would require any scripting/coding. The main difference is not having a set mode distinguishing online types.

So the 1% about people not coders is probably true, but it only adds to what you can do between both games. You can still spawn planes, ships, trucks, or any other object without a single line of code.

All the other stuff you did to setup missions in the old game were all created by 3rd party - Dgen, FBDj, etc., etc.,

I understand the need for COOP integration and eventually somebody will probably make a program that does all the work for you, just like the old game. But you're making it sound as if what you did FMB-wise / comparing the old and new IL2, one requires code - which is false. But with the new one it allows you to expand missions with programming if you want to / know how.

[KG26_Alpha]

Originally Posted by ATAG_Bliss

Well, HL will come when the game is fixed. Servers like ours have soo many variables to look for to keep automatically running 24/7 that to add another program into the loop atm would be a royal PITA atm.

If we can make it stable, we'd be using HL too. But there's no point until the game gets there in the 1st place.

As far as the FMB, it's very similar. And there isn't a single thing you can't do in the FMB (besides the broken stuff) compared to the old game that would require any scripting/coding. The main difference is not having a set mode distinguishing online types.

So the 1% about people not coders is probably true, but it only adds to what you can do between both games. You can still spawn planes, ships, trucks, or any other object without a single line of code.

All the other stuff you did to setup missions in the old game were all created by 3rd party - Dgen, FBDj, etc., etc.,

I understand the need for COOP integration and eventually somebody will probably make a program that does all the work for you, just like the old game. But you're making it sound as if what you did FMB-wise / comparing the old and new IL2, one requires code - which is false. But with the new one it allows you to expand missions with programming if you want to / know how.

Im not comparing the new/old.

The difference is the new is sometimes it's unnecessarily difficult, look at the old ac delay spawn, then the new for example ??

If you took 100 that can use the FMB in IL2 then gave them the CoD one 99% wouldn't know how to use the scripting only 1% would is what I meant.

I have made around 2-3 thousand missions in IL2 series and used sometimes the Lowngrin DCG and Starshoys in game DCG in the past to host squad campaigns under CooP conditions, we have tried DF & MDS it don't really work.

Yup its a bad sales point leaving out the CooP interface, but there's more pressing things to sort first for 1C Team and hopefully we will all get what we want from the thing at some point.






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[ATAG_Bliss]

Originally Posted by KG26_Alpha

Im not comparing the new/old.

The difference is the new is sometimes it's unnecessarily difficult, look at the old ac delay spawn, then the new for example ??

If you took 100 that can use the FMB in IL2 then gave them the CoD one 99% wouldn't know how to use the scripting only 1% would is what I meant.

I have made around 2-3 thousand missions in IL2 series and used sometimes the Lowngrin DCG and Starshoys in game DCG in the past to host squad campaigns under CooP conditions, we have tried DF & MDS it don't really work.

Yup its a bad sales point leaving out the CooP interface, but there's more pressing things to sort first for 1C Team and hopefully we will all get what we want from the thing at some point.






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But can't you see the advantages why the spawn delay is that way? In the old, sure you could just delay the spawn right in the properties of the airgroup itself. Once the delay went off, there's your spawn.

Well, now you have the ability to do the same thing by simply linking a spawn group trigger with a delay trigger. But now you have the advantage of making as many triggers/TT delays with that single airgroup. If you want that thing to spawn every hour, every 10 seconds, every second etc. Now you can do it without having to ever put another object in the mission.

Not only is there less clutter, but it makes for soo many more possibilities. Add coding on top of that, then next thing you know you have events triggering when things spawn, destroy, land, w/e - the makings for a completely dynamic environment where things occur based on what players do. So, I for one am happy that it's this way. It just makes this one soo much better.

[KG26_Alpha]

Originally Posted by ATAG_Bliss

But can't you see the advantages why the spawn delay is that way? In the old, sure you could just delay the spawn right in the properties of the airgroup itself. Once the delay went off, there's your spawn.

Well, now you have the ability to do the same thing by simply linking a spawn group trigger with a delay trigger. But now you have the advantage of making as many triggers/TT delays with that single airgroup. If you want that thing to spawn every hour, every 10 seconds, every second etc. Now you can do it without having to ever put another object in the mission.

Not only is there less clutter, but it makes for soo many more possibilities. Add coding on top of that, then next thing you know you have events triggering when things spawn, destroy, land, w/e - the makings for a completely dynamic environment where things occur based on what players do. So, I for one am happy that it's this way. It just makes this one soo much better.

Have you actually read the Tutorial I made in the Mission Builder section of this forum regarding triggers ?

I know what Im talking about here, after having the game for a year and using every aspect of it including scripting.

What I'm talking about is keeping it simple and thus increasing the FMB user base, increasing the servers and CoD online users.

I don't want 1 or 2 DF servers dictating the way I use the game no matter how clever its setup, give us proper CooP mode and a simple FMB to create missions and host them.



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[ElAurens]

What would go a long way is a concise user guide for the FMB, not just a post at SimHQ on how to modify one of the stock single player missions for offline use.

Honestly, I went into the FMB last night and all I could accomplish was to get an AI Spitfire to endlessly circle over base. No way to spawn on the ground in said Spitfire, no indication that the base was red or blue, and no way to launch the mission, even though it shows up in my single player mission list.

It's infuriating for someone who has made missions for years in IL2.

[addman]

I think it's great that CloD has really advanced features such as scripting and stuff. There are some very talented people out there that can do magic with the tools at their disposal BUT there also have to be a more accessible side to it. Nobody is denying that CloD is a step forward in terms of FMB features compared to 1946 but it's a step backwards (which I never expected) when it comes to being intuitive and accessible. This goes for the whole game IMO, they really need someone with previous experience in making user friendly GUI's, I hope they hire at least one of those. It's a turn-off for newcomers to the game but it's almost even a turn off for a long time fan like myself. I hope to see improvements in the future, hope.

[ATAG_Bliss]

Originally Posted by addman

I think it's great that CloD has really advanced features such as scripting and stuff. There are some very talented people out there that can do magic with the tools at their disposal BUT there also have to be a more accessible side to it. Nobody is denying that CloD is a step forward in terms of FMB features compared to 1946 but it's a step backwards (which I never expected) when it comes to being intuitive and accessible. This goes for the whole game IMO, they really need someone with previous experience in making user friendly GUI's, I hope they hire at least one of those. It's a turn-off for newcomers to the game but it's almost even a turn off for a long time fan like myself. I hope to see improvements in the future, hope.

I think the problem is everyone is scared of it. Just looking through this thread I can tell there's plenty of false things spread about the FMB in the 1st place. To me it's just like 46's FMB, with some features added. If you really know how to do stuff in the old game, then the new one should be fairly straight forward as well - minus if you want to get into scripting.

[ATAG_Bliss]

Originally Posted by KG26_Alpha

Have you actually read the Tutorial I made in the Mission Builder section of this forum regarding triggers ?

I know what Im talking about here, after having the game for a year and using every aspect of it including scripting.

What I'm talking about is keeping it simple and thus increasing the FMB user base, increasing the servers and CoD online users.

I don't want 1 or 2 DF servers dictating the way I use the game no matter how clever its setup, give us proper CooP mode and a simple FMB to create missions and host them.

No offense, but why would I read the tutorial on the FMB? Did you make it when the game came out? I'm not the one complaining about the difficulty in using it. You were complaining about triggers hence why I pointed out why it's soo much better the way they are implemented compared to 46.

For people like yourself, what I don't understand is why don't you just host a pw protected server to do your COOP style play in (for the time being). You come on here and complain about not having your old style COOP. Why can't you do the same thing by just starting a mission where you spawn from? Sure it's great, I guess, that you could pick your name on a list in some menu instead of clicking on an airfield. But it's not like you can't achieve the same thing (everyone flying at the same time towards your goal of the map).

And again, the FMB in cliffs is just like the FMB in the old game. Why are you complaining about it's difficulty? Please go into specifics here (comparing the 2). I mean, posts saying that the FMB is difficulty in one game compared to the FMB in the other lends me to believe you haven't spent much time with it. Because, side by side, they are virtually the same without the added features that cliffs allows you to do with it.

Originally Posted by ElAurens

What would go a long way is a concise user guide for the FMB, not just a post at SimHQ on how to modify one of the stock single player missions for offline use.

Honestly, I went into the FMB last night and all I could accomplish was to get an AI Spitfire to endlessly circle over base. No way to spawn on the ground in said Spitfire, no indication that the base was red or blue, and no way to launch the mission, even though it shows up in my single player mission list.

It's infuriating for someone who has made missions for years in IL2.

Again, I don't understand this. You must spend 5 seconds in the FMB and quit. Inside the properties of that spitfire not only will you see altitude is default at 500m, but there's a few checkboxes that you can click on the one's that read "player plane" and "spawn parked" should kinda give it away.

Spawn parked means it's parked where you place it "on the ground" - Player plane should be fairly obvious as well.

And of course your AI spitfire is just going to sit there and turn circles. All you did was give it a single way point and nothing else.

This is exactly like old 46. Do I have a different version of the game or something? How is stuff like this difficult? Are you sure you made missions in the old game?

[SlipBall]

Originally Posted by ElAurens

What would go a long way is a concise user guide for the FMB, not just a post at SimHQ on how to modify one of the stock single player missions for offline use.

Honestly, I went into the FMB last night and all I could accomplish was to get an AI Spitfire to endlessly circle over base. No way to spawn on the ground in said Spitfire, no indication that the base was red or blue, and no way to launch the mission, even though it shows up in my single player mission list.

It's infuriating for someone who has made missions for years in IL2.

Hi ElAurens, I know that you have a long history making missions and that I'm sorry that you are having problems. Could you describe your basic mission that you are having a problem with. Is the AI supposed to be your wing man in the mission, or is he to take off from a separate different base?

[ATAG_MajorBorris]

From: ElJoven,

"So, time to get down to the point. Nobody I play sims with finds IL-2 Cliffs of Dover worth their time. The single player is bland. The multi player is worse. There's no dynamic campaign and the development teams refusal to compensate for the fact that this is a sim played on a computer monitor leads to unrealistic engagements.

So, the game needs to be fixed. So far nobody I've spoken to is impressed with the direction IL-2 is headed and a few have already taken a 'won't get fooled again' stance when it comes to the Moscow expansion coming out. If you want us back, you need to make this a better game."


You have to know the patch could come out any time now, whats your point. It sounds like you and nobody you know all dont fly the sim. Let me tell you, if you have not found the genius in what CoD is at the moment regardless of bugs etc, you will never be satisfied IMHO...no patch will remake the sim in your image.

Blanket statements regarding the purchase of future il2 expansions are ludicris if you allready cant find any positive in the ww2 cfs we have at hand.

Jiminy creepers dude, at least find a plane you like and then post improvements that are needed after you have flown the crap out of it, untill then I find no credibility in these type of posts(thats right we have all read this same stuff over and over if you allready dont know)

Oh and if your friends dont know allready it takes a good year or more before any ww2 cfs gets better.

rant over, now I can go to lunch