Interview with WWII reconaissance pilot

[WTE_Galway]

Originally Posted by Dutch_851

Even when we were given time, the combined forces of France and the British Expeditionary Force were unable to hold back the Blitzkrieg tactics of Guderian and co.

Actually the combined forces of France, Belgium, Holland and the British Expeditionary Force held out only a week or two more than Poland all alone had managed. The Poles inflicted proportionally more casualties for their size as well, with around 10,000 Germans killed in Poland versus 30-40,000 killed in France against much greater odds. In addition the Poles manage to destroy or temporarily take out of action 25% of the Luftwaffe. The Poles did far far better than later propaganda about "cavalry and biplanes against armor" would suggest.

More significantly, at the time of first invading Poland, Heinz Guderian and co were all (surprise surprise) over in Poland. Hitler took a huge risk against the advice of his own military and left the western border with France undefended during the Polish campaign. This was a massive gamble hoping that the French and British would hold back on attacking until they felt more prepared. The gamble paid off.

In other words an attack by the French/British at the time Germany was tied up in Poland may well have succeeded.

[ATAG_Dutch]

Originally Posted by WTE_Galway

More significantly, at the time of first invading Poland, Heinz Guderian and co were all (surprise surprise) over in Poland. Hitler took a huge risk against the advice of his own military and left the western border with France undefended during the Polish campaign. This was a massive gamble hoping that the French and British would hold back on attacking until they felt more prepared. The gamble paid off.

In other words an attack by the French/British at the time Germany was tied up in Poland may well have succeeded.

Agree with most of your post, although Britain and France would not have gone against the wishes of Belgium and Holland in order to go around the 'Siegfried line', which although in the process of being built from 37-39 and into 1940, even with the commitment of forces elsewhere would still have been left reasonably manned.
This is why I said I 'can't envisage what form this would take' in the previous post, as the only other option available would be to plan a seaborne invasion of either northern Germany or Poland itself for which neither Britain nor France were equipped. The fleet would have been harried every step of the way, outside of the range of effective fighter cover
Attempting to go through the Siegfried Line, could easily have resulted in 14-18 conditions for a short time. Then once the main German Forces returned from Poland......

[Theshark888]

Originally Posted by Dutch_851

Agree with most of your post, although Britain and France would not have gone against the wishes of Belgium and Holland in order to go around the 'Siegfried line', which although in the process of being built from 37-39 and into 1940, even with the commitment of forces elsewhere would still have been left reasonably manned.
This is why I said I 'can't envisage what form this would take' in the previous post, as the only other option available would be to plan a seaborne invasion of either northern Germany or Poland itself for which neither Britain nor France were equipped. The fleet would have been harried every step of the way, outside of the range of effective fighter cover
Attempting to go through the Siegfried Line, could easily have resulted in 14-18 conditions for a short time. Then once the main German Forces returned from Poland......

I believe that Hitler would have been overthrown at some point. There was no need for the Allies to advance all the way to Berlin...once the Rhine was encircled, Germany would have collapsed. The Siegfried Line was not all that it was cracked up to be.

[ATAG_Dutch]

Originally Posted by Theshark888

I believe that Hitler would have been overthrown at some point. There was no need for the Allies to advance all the way to Berlin...once the Rhine was encircled, Germany would have collapsed. The Siegfried Line was not all that it was cracked up to be.

Well, he wasn't.
Germany would not have allowed the encirclement of the Rhineland, and intelligence regarding the Siegfried line is available now, whereas we don't know what level of intelligence information the allies had then.

We may as well debate whether if Gavrilo Princip had been unsuccessful in assassinating Franz Ferdinand, there would have been no First War, no Treaty of Versailles, no rise of Hitler to power and thus no Second War.

What happened, happened. Endless debate of 'what if's' ain't gonna change much.
If you consider it Britain and France's faults that things escalated to the level they did, carry on, but I still think this is far too simplistic a perspective.

Anyway, back to America......

[Theshark888]

Originally Posted by Dutch_851

Anyway, back to America......

Good conversation guys...sometimes it's good to "mix it up" and defend the homeland a little

The "evil" USA bit does get old after a while, but it is to be expected on a mixed US/Euro forum such as this and all over the internet. Don't be shocked if an American stands up once in a while and acts "arrogant." I guess it is so ingrained in some Euros minds that they don't even realize that they are bashing the US and it does put us in a constant defensive mode as Triggaar said

That's all for me, can't wait for SOW to be released

[Triggaaar]

Originally Posted by Theshark888

The "evil" USA bit does get old after a while, but it is to be expected on a mixed US/Euro forum such as this and all over the internet...
I guess it is so ingrained in some Euros minds that they don't even realize that they are bashing the US

Come on, has someone in this thread made any suggestion that the US are evil? Could you quote where someone is bashing the US? (I'm not saying they haven't I just haven't seen it, and I don't think I have, so please quote where it's happened)

[Splitter]

Originally Posted by Triggaaar

Come on, has someone in this thread made any suggestion that the US are evil? Could you quote where someone is bashing the US? (I'm not saying they haven't I just haven't seen it, and I don't think I have, so please quote where it's happened)

Trig, I am not going to call out any individual and I specifically wrote my post (not the one you quoted but mine was similar) in an effort not to offend any individual.

My guess is that if you did a search on this board on "oil", "US", "Iran", "Iraq", "Israel", and some other associated terms, you would see what some have said. Sometimes the comments are direct, sometimes code words are used.

Hey, it's ok though. I understand a lot of the criticism and some of it I agree with (dangling participle anyone?). What I never understand is blind prejudice. I'm happy to carry on any foreign policy discussions or simple exchanges of ideas via PM or elsewhere. While this discussion has been good AND civil, unfortunately this thread got horribly derailed and as a participant, I apologize to the OP.

For the record, I love talking to people from elsewhere in the world. We generally have a lot of totally different experiences and perspectives and I usually find such discussions educational and interesting.

Splitter