Orcs on the March thread

[atlatea]

Yeah, i'd recomend rune mage too againts scrounger, in my opinion, if you plan to bring lv 5 unit againts scrounger, rune mage is a must, you'll always lose lv 5 unit, because of those double drain from double ogres (i hate them) and probably astral attack too (if you don't disable her shamans).


As for dancing axe, yeah, seems you're right, dancing axe seems to bypass defense, probably since the legend, because i have bad moments againts orc shaman in KB TL, i forgot because of what, though i think it's because of dancing axe. But not all abilities bypass defence, seems it's only for orc.

[Kings Bounty Hunter]

My army is Inq, R griffins, paladins, rune and arch mages, engineers and trolls. I have finally got lvl 3 ressurect so I no longer need Paladins, they don't fight too much tbh

Phantom and Dragon eggs are my preferred method, physical damage mostly, sometimes the ancient phoenix.

I'm struggling to think how the Paladin is better than Mage and Warrior tbh

[atlatea]

Simple, Holy armor 3 and resurrection 3 (boost inquisitor and paladin resurection capabilities), also the +40% medal of inquisitor and paladin. The fastest class to get voice of dragon 3 (if you like dragons) and adrenaline 3.

Indeed most of the time paladins don't fight much, but in hardest battles, they fight much, and also they eat demons alive (boosted with 40% dmg, add inq sword if you want). And they're the only option right now for mass resurrection.

The only thing paladin envy about warrior is the ability to start with rage. Paladin has many things that compensate for the double cast of mage.

[ckdamascus]

Originally Posted by atlatea

Yeah, i'd recomend rune mage too againts scrounger, in my opinion, if you plan to bring lv 5 unit againts scrounger, rune mage is a must, you'll always lose lv 5 unit, because of those double drain from double ogres (i hate them) and probably astral attack too (if you don't disable her shamans).


As for dancing axe, yeah, seems you're right, dancing axe seems to bypass defense, probably since the legend, because i have bad moments againts orc shaman in KB TL, i forgot because of what, though i think it's because of dancing axe. But not all abilities bypass defence, seems it's only for orc.

Right. It does seem all the other abilities are affected so far (I'll keep you guys posted on it, but it does seem that bypassing defense is an exception rather than the norm) I hope this wasn't some latent Porc, I mean Orc, advantage.

Thankfully with the Gift Bag items such as the Crown of Chaos, Shaman were no longer to be feared, even if they did bypass. It was fairly easy to stack close to85%+ magic resistance, or 95% even.

Who would have guessed they would replace the terror with two more units. Haha.

Regarding Paladin, yes, Paladins are EXCELLENT IF you use Paladin and Inquisitor. I do envy Holy Armor a lot too haha.

Yeah, it seems that with the right unit mixture, the Paladin can get around the double-cast issue. However, the Paladin seems forced into a set of units since it synergizes too well with paladins and inquisitors and you will require supplemental units to augment your disabling capabilities.

The Paladin Unit is one of those units I hate/love. They seem to be the only way for me to roll well with a Warrior class, since it is far more efficient to mass resurrect via Turn Back Time + Prayer than Phantom.

[jake21]

Not sure why you recommend rune mages; I left mine home for this fight. Did him with a stack of green dragons; black knight and paladin (mage impossible). Fight wasn't that hard but I did suffer the loss of green dragons (could restore the paladins/knight at end). I did not use counter attack on the knights and I suspect some other unit such as regular knights might be just as good (maybe better since I'm summing paladins at the end to restore the stack). The problem I had with rune mages is that the stack is completely wiped out on first move (strangely no matter what I chose; I could never get my initiative high enough to move before all his). I did think about trying arch mages since they tend to be astral resistant. Hum.

Originally Posted by ckdamascus

Right. It does seem all the other abilities are affected so far (I'll keep you guys posted on it, but it does seem that bypassing defense is an exception rather than the norm) I hope this wasn't some latent Porc, I mean Orc, advantage.

Thankfully with the Gift Bag items such as the Crown of Chaos, Shaman were no longer to be feared, even if they did bypass. It was fairly easy to stack close to85%+ magic resistance, or 95% even.

Who would have guessed they would replace the terror with two more units. Haha.

Regarding Paladin, yes, Paladins are EXCELLENT IF you use Paladin and Inquisitor. I do envy Holy Armor a lot too haha.

Yeah, it seems that with the right unit mixture, the Paladin can get around the double-cast issue. However, the Paladin seems forced into a set of units since it synergizes too well with paladins and inquisitors and you will require supplemental units to augment your disabling capabilities.

The Paladin Unit is one of those units I hate/love. They seem to be the only way for me to roll well with a Warrior class, since it is far more efficient to mass resurrect via Turn Back Time + Prayer than Phantom.

[ckdamascus]

Originally Posted by jake21

Not sure why you recommend rune mages; I left mine home for this fight. Did him with a stack of green dragons; black knight and paladin (mage impossible). Fight wasn't that hard but I did suffer the loss of green dragons (could restore the paladins/knight at end). I did not use counter attack on the knights and I suspect some other unit such as regular knights might be just as good (maybe better since I'm summing paladins at the end to restore the stack). The problem I had with rune mages is that the stack is completely wiped out on first move (strangely no matter what I chose; I could never get my initiative high enough to move before all his). I did think about trying arch mages since they tend to be astral resistant. Hum.

Rune mages can revive your level 5s. I can't bear to lose a precious level 5 unit.

I probably did double phantom with the rune mages early on (and/or I experimented with phantom + black hole) for that very reason. They can blow through my phantoms and deal damage to my real rune mages.

I don't believe any unit has natural astral resistance. The Rune mage "MIGHT" but it wouldn't be anything to write home about. The translated AP manual is wrong. It calls "magic resistance" as "astral resistance".

Not to mention, orcs tend to bypass the Defense statistics with their abilities.

To win the initiative war, I use black dragons, so the double phantoms come up before the enemy can act. I might have onslaught 1 as well. But, unless you are in "control" of the battle to prevent a black dragon loss in a single volley of hits (you aren't, since the enemy clearly overpowers us), to avoid a loss with black dragons, they MUST be paired with rune mages Or shaman (rune mages are better, since they can revive black dragons, shaman can heal a black dragon via dancing axes).

High physical resistance units is definitely a good idea though.

[jake21]

Yea I definitely use blackhole for this fight; To a degree I think that spell is overpowered. Hum. I'm there now; so maybe I'll back up one save and try with rune mages/black dragons. Wonder if royal snakes have a high enough initative (probably not). Hum. Kind of hate to buy blackdragons; hate em. I have 4 fights left this game (k'tul (or whatever he is called); top floor of mage tower; this fight if i redo it and 'the end' fight). K'tul is gonna be a bear; I think they beefed him up; what troupes did you use for him? Hum. If black dragons are immune to his area attack maybe he is a good candidate... though the rune mages will die fast

Originally Posted by ckdamascus

Rune mages can revive your level 5s. I can't bear to lose a precious level 5 unit.

I probably did double phantom with the rune mages early on (and/or I experimented with phantom + black hole) for that very reason. They can blow through my phantoms and deal damage to my real rune mages.

I don't believe any unit has natural astral resistance. The Rune mage "MIGHT" but it wouldn't be anything to write home about. The translated AP manual is wrong. It calls "magic resistance" as "astral resistance".

Not to mention, orcs tend to bypass the Defense statistics with their abilities.

To win the initiative war, I use black dragons, so the double phantoms come up before the enemy can act. I might have onslaught 1 as well. But, unless you are in "control" of the battle to prevent a black dragon loss in a single volley of hits (you aren't, since the enemy clearly overpowers us), to avoid a loss with black dragons, they MUST be paired with rune mages Or shaman (rune mages are better, since they can revive black dragons, shaman can heal a black dragon via dancing axes).

High physical resistance units is definitely a good idea though.

[Saiko Kila]

Originally Posted by ckdamascus

I don't believe any unit has natural astral resistance.

I think that only Infernal dragons have declared astral resistance, but it has negative value for them. So many disabilities. Poor creatures.

[atlatea]

Infernal dragon currently is worthless, ancient phoenix is way better, like 2 times the infernal dragon with almost half mana required.

Scrounger fight is not hard to win, but it's hard to win for no loss fight.

To win initiative againts scrounger, bring black dragon (also rune mage for no loss fight, why? i guarantee you'll lose some of your black dragons) and blue dragon pet. To super win initiative, beside BD+ blue pet, you must have warrior caution 3 (+3 initiative at turn 1), enough to beat all scrounger units initiative except her ogres (only black dragon and posibly unicorn/red dragon can beat ogres initiative).

For non mage, to make your rune mage 100% survive astral attack at round 1 (even with 70% astral resistance, her goblin shamans can kill 14 rune mage with 3x astral attack), cast target to your stack. Well, you have another astral attack from orc shaman (luckily this one is much much weaker). For mage, since mage can double cast, why not target then sheep her orc shaman. You can also phantom, though it's a gamble, because it's not guaranteed that those shamans will attack the phantom.

Note that astral attack from orc shaman is much much weaker than goblin shaman, so you can ignore them, though in prolonged battle these orc shamans can make your no loss fight to become loss fight.

[jake21]

So I tried the black dragon and did indeed win the fight with no loss (mage impossible); however black dragon did not give me first move. Still it did keep me from being 'last move' which was enough to turn the tide. Oh well live and learn. The one thing that was a bit weird is that my warrior (impossible) really struggled on the mage tower; so i was expecting it to be near impossible for my mage (impossible) yet it was very easy.

Originally Posted by atlatea

Infernal dragon currently is worthless, ancient phoenix is way better, like 2 times the infernal dragon with almost half mana required.

Scrounger fight is not hard to win, but it's hard to win for no loss fight.

To win initiative againts scrounger, bring black dragon (also rune mage for no loss fight, why? i guarantee you'll lose some of your black dragons) and blue dragon pet. To super win initiative, beside BD+ blue pet, you must have warrior caution 3 (+3 initiative at turn 1), enough to beat all scrounger units initiative except her ogres (only black dragon and posibly unicorn/red dragon can beat ogres initiative).

For non mage, to make your rune mage 100% survive astral attack at round 1 (even with 70% astral resistance, her goblin shamans can kill 14 rune mage with 3x astral attack), cast target to your stack. Well, you have another astral attack from orc shaman (luckily this one is much much weaker). For mage, since mage can double cast, why not target then sheep her orc shaman. You can also phantom, though it's a gamble, because it's not guaranteed that those shamans will attack the phantom.

Note that astral attack from orc shaman is much much weaker than goblin shaman, so you can ignore them, though in prolonged battle these orc shamans can make your no loss fight to become loss fight.