Interview with WWII reconaissance pilot

[WTE_Galway]

Well if you were going to TRY and claim a "just war" exists this century it would have to be the resistance by individuals in Iraq against incredible odds to repel foreign invasion that was illegal and ideologically/religious in motivation.

But personally I do not believe there is any such thing as a "just war". The idea of a "just war" is simply a fiction created by politicians of all sides to con the gullible public.

There are simply wars and your side does all it can to win as quickly and efficiently as possible.

[Splitter]

Originally Posted by WTE_Galway

Well if you were going to TRY and claim a "just war" exists this century it would have to be the resistance by individuals in Iraq against incredible odds to repel foreign invasion that was illegal and ideologically/religious in motivation.

But personally I do not believe there is any such thing as a "just war". The idea of a "just war" is simply a fiction created by politicians of all sides to con the gullible public.

There are simply wars and your side does all it can to win as quickly and efficiently as possible.

The only people I see in opposition are funded and supplied by terrorist organizations whose hatred is based on religion. I'm not really seeing any patriotic Iraqi independence movement.

And if our motivation was religious...why are we not trying to convert them Tokemata style?

Is it ideological to think that people prefer democracy over dictatorship?

Hey, I'm not saying we went to war to free the Iraqi people. That was only putting a nice face on the fact that we went in to get Saddam. But in the end, the Iraqi people are now in charge of their own future for the first time in a long time. What they do with it is up to them.

To say there is never a just war is to say that a country should never go to war. That's a hard sell to a country that is being invaded or attacked. So if no wars are just, they must all be unjust, yes? Was the US going to war with Japan unjust? Was Russia going to war with Germany unjust? Was Britain's air defense in the BoB unjust?

I think it is perfectly valid to ask whether an action in a "just" war is "unjust" or not (Dresden for example), but the verdict on the action would not invalidate the "justness" of the war itself.

If countries are never justified in going to war, then an individual is never justified in defending themselves. So is a homeowner who shoots a home-invader guilty of an unjustified homicide?

Splitter

[swiss]

So is a homeowner who shoots a home-invader guilty of an unjustified homicide?

Perfect example.

In Switzerland you'll spend the next 15 years jail, in Texas they will buy you a jug of beer.

[WTE_Galway]

Originally Posted by Splitter

Is it ideological to think that people prefer democracy over dictatorship?

Absolutely ... and so are the other classic US assumptions, that capitalism is good and that individual personal rights are paramount. These are ideological viewpoints that others may disagree with and need to be argued for, not obvious truths about the nature of the Cosmos.

It is pretty much only in the US that democracy is seen as some sort of infallibly perfect "one size fits all" solution that will solve all problems ... and its arguable whether even the US is truly a democracy anymore anyway, for starters most politicians are career politicians who started their apprenticeship for public office with one major party or other sometime around leaving high school so the US is ruled by a "political class" of power brokers.

In actual fact democracy only works in educated relatively well off first world countries such as the US. Even then it is generally corrupted by corporate business interests but in a first world country that does not really matter.

In a third world country where the population is illiterate and poor and the media is controlled by political, religious or business interests elections tend to be a farce and that is before you consider vote rigging.

Democracy does not work in the third world.



One of the most amusing things about US politics though is the way the main proponents of bringing "democracy" to the rest of the world, the far right, really do not actually believe in democracy at all. they believe in "good old American values" and feel have a god given right to rule and that everyone else should just acknowledge that and do as they are told

[K_Freddie]

Great stuff .. as usual - thanks FPSOlkor

We were returning from a mission, one Il was coming back with a large hole in the wing. I positioned myself over him, and said:
— Humpback, humpback, through a hole in your wing I’m viewing landmarks.
He replied:
— F.CK YOU…!!!

[Theshark888]

Originally Posted by WTE_Galway

In actual fact democracy only works in educated relatively well off first world countries such as the US. Democracy does not work in the third world.

Shocking view of the world. Smells of typical European elitism. I think you need to do some research about Democracy and you will see the huge amount of benefits that this system has. Do you think this country was a Super Power when it was founded??????????

America acts the way it does today because we were dragged into 2 World Wars and the next would be an even worse catastrophe. The same reason we stayed in Europe, Japan, . Korea, etc.

[swiss]

Originally Posted by Theshark888

Shocking view of the world. Smells of typical European elitism. I think you need to do some research about Democracy and you will see the huge amount of benefits that this system has. Do you think this country was a Super Power when it was founded??????????

America acts the way it does today because we were dragged into 2 World Wars and the next would be an even worse catastrophe. The same reason we stayed in Europe, Japan, . Korea, etc.

For democracy to work you need the right people first - the ones in the 3rd world are not yet ready.[you have no idea about their mentality, I suggest you research]

Africa:
Defacto you would have to recolonize them, make sure the money goes where it's supposed to, and make sure you educate the people.

Once >70% of the people can read and write, you can give it another try.
Sounds like work for ~70 years.

Or we can just wait, we'll get the same result in 200 years or so.

Islam:
They just need their contemporary version of Luther and a elephant dose of enlightenment. Or just wait another 3 to 400 years...

[drewpee]

Imagine there's no Heaven
It's easy if you try
No hell below us
Above us only sky
Imagine all the people
Living for today

Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace

You may say that I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will be as one

Imagine no possessions
I wonder if you can
No need for greed or hunger
A brotherhood of man
Imagine all the people
Sharing all the world

You may say that I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will live as one

True words of wisdom.

[Splitter]

Sounds like a communist utopia .

1) There are things in those lyrics that would not make the world a better place in the view of many of us.
2) It would only take one person with ambition, political objectives, desire of power, or simply having a bad day to mess up the utopia in that song. People have always been, are, and will always be imperfect.
3) Cool song. Really, we played it at our wedding and everyone danced to it. I don't know anyone who hates that song.
4) I choose to take the song as someone's "dream" rather than a political manifesto. Drugs were probably involved in that dream lol.

Splitter