Banning Planes

[Soviet Ace]

Originally Posted by Pubestien13

I will never understand Soviet Ace's obsession with soviet aircraft. Stop being biest. In the European theater the kill ratios speak for themselves and they favor other planes more than russian. I'm not doubting that russia came up with some good fighters. And nobody can say that any peice of russian war equipment isn't good unless in numbers. I'm sorry but that's what they've done in the past and forever will do, that's just the way they think. Just look at their tanks and sheer amounts of AK's, but thats besides the point.

And I'm sure if there weren't rotation's of U.S. pilots their kill ratio's would be alot higher, but Swagger7 has a point on the target rich environment.

Well if you know anything about Soviet Planes. You'll know about a specific dogfight that was HUGE on the Eastern Front in 1944. A small squadron of Yak-3s were doing a small patrol (5 or 6 about) and were bounced by at least 10 or 12 190s. The dogfight gradually erupted into 18 190s against 12 Yak-3s and guess who won? Yak-3s. They lost two fights against the seven 190s they downed.

And the reason I'm interested in Soviet Planes is because to me, the Soviets built some of the best TnB fighters of the War. I'm naturally drawn to low-medium altitude fighters. And the Soviets provide me with that. I also enjoy many Japanese planes as well. Their light armor and fast pace, have always made me enjoy learning about them. So saying I am biased is way off. Enjoying one group of planes over another, is not being biased if you do accept that some planes can out do yours. But compared to German planes, many Soviet planes prevailed in low-medium altitudes better. And you do know that in 1941, when Russia was blitzed, that German planes (Me110s etc.) attacked the air fields first, and destroyed many Soviet planes before they could get off the ground. But by 1942, many Soviet pilot training groups had a complete overhaul, and many Soviet pilots began racking up the kills.

Take Stalingrad for example. Many of the pilots over Stalingrad were guess what? Women! That's right, most Soviet pilots flying over Stalingrad were women. And they racked up enough kills, even over their own loss numbers to have air superiority over the city. Leningrad was a standstill, and mostly because the LaGG and MiG factories were closer to Leningrad than say Stalingrad.

Me being biased, is nothing different than anyone else. Some on here favor the Spitfire (David603), and some enjoy the Hurricane (FOZ). They both always talk about the Spitfire or Hurricane any chance they get. Sorry to drag you both into this, but you understand what I mean.

[FOZ_1983]

i hold my hand up, i do love talking about the hurricane, and also taking the piss out of the ruski planes....but all in good jest.

I know how good the hurri really is and as the war goes one what duties it can do better than the other. I also know how good the ruski crates are, i just like to have some banter with soviet ace about them. Im a huge fan of the hurrie, i will defend it where and when i can. But in a dogfight... 9/10 i will take a spitfire. Because i know as much as i like my hurricane, it just lacks in some areas.

The russian planes are good at what they are meant to do...... be fast and agile, or slow and heavy (Yak/IL2)


on topic...soviet, yes i know exacly what you mean

[FOZ_1983]

and the F4U corsair being the best fighter of the war?

hmmmmmm debatable!!


how would you class a fighter as the best?

on kills alone?
kill to death ratio?
armament?
speed?
manouvrability?
cost?


in all honesty their is no "best fighter of ww2" because for as long as humans are alive then they will always debate between many different choices.

try a poll just for peace of mind and give the choices as erm..... for example -

spitfire
mustang
109
corsair
zero

just 5 examples their and see what results you would get. I myself would choose the spitfire, but know for a fact many would disagree and then tell me im wrong and why they think "plane of choice" is better.

at the end of the day.... each to their own

[mattd27]

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace

Take Stalingrad for example. Many of the pilots over Stalingrad were guess what? Women! That's right, most Soviet pilots flying over Stalingrad were women. And they racked up enough kills, even over their own loss numbers to have air superiority over the city.

Yes, I was reading about that. I found it quite funny how it was a huge moral loss for the germans that they were being shot down and killed by woman.

[Soviet Ace]

Originally Posted by FOZ_1983

i hold my hand up, i do love talking about the hurricane, and also taking the piss out of the ruski planes....but all in good jest.

I know how good the hurri really is and as the war goes one what duties it can do better than the other. I also know how good the ruski crates are, i just like to have some banter with soviet ace about them. Im a huge fan of the hurrie, i will defend it where and when i can. But in a dogfight... 9/10 i will take a spitfire. Because i know as much as i like my hurricane, it just lacks in some areas.

The russian planes are good at what they are meant to do...... be fast and agile, or slow and heavy (Yak/IL2)


on topic...soviet, yes i know exacly what you mean

Exactly my point. Enjoying one or several planes of one side does not make you bias. I enjoy Soviet Planes more than British or American planes, but I still enjoy learning and reading about all nations planes. I just prefer the Soviet planes over the others.

Originally Posted by mattd27

Yes, I was reading about that. I found it quite funny how it was a huge moral loss for the germans that they were being shot down and killed by woman.

And yes, many of the women became aces within a day! But sadly one of the best women pilots to grace the Easter skies was killed

[tango2delta]

Originally Posted by mattd27

Yes, I was reading about that. I found it quite funny how it was a huge moral loss for the germans that they were being shot down and killed by woman.

Yes the W.A.S.P, Valentina Grizodubova, Lily Litvyak, Marina Raskova all where great pilots. The germans pilots i think called them something else, Anybody Know?

[Soviet Ace]

Originally Posted by tango2delta

Yes the W.A.S.P, Valentina Grizodubova, Lily Litvyak, Marina Raskova all where great pilots. The germans pilots i think called them something else, Anybody Know?

I dunno if the German pilots had a nickname for the women, but Lily Litvyak, was called the "White Rose of Stalingrad". I'm not actually sure how that came around, but I think it was because her plane usually had a white rose painted on either the nose cowling, or some where else?

[mattd27]

Originally Posted by tango2delta

Yes the W.A.S.P, Valentina Grizodubova, Lily Litvyak, Marina Raskova all where great pilots. The germans pilots i think called them something else, Anybody Know?

They called some of them "Night Witches" I believe? Because they did a lot of bombing raids during the night presumably.

[Soviet Ace]

Originally Posted by mattd27

They called some of them "Night Witches" I believe? Because they did a lot of bombing raids during the night presumably.

Oh he's right. They called the 558th Night Bomber Regiment which would later become known as the 46th Guards Night Bomber Regiment. It was an all women's regiment.

Good going Matt. I even had to look it up in my book on Soviet Aces, just to make sure.

[Pubestien13]

You cant be biased if someone's biased. Your originial statements were irrelivent to the original topic. Your lack logic proves my point still. Your answer for everthing is Russia, Russia, Russia. The fact that I acknowledge other planes, including some russian one's, as some of the greatist planes of all time makes me completly not biased. Just accept the fact that you're biased towards russian aircraft and move on. Come up with different material. End.