[bongodriver]

Still, "berg" in connection with another native english word is rather odd.

isn't ice simply an anglicised version of eis?

Nope, "appreciated" would be the wrong word here for sure.

Appreciation is not always a positive acceptance but more a simple understanding of the way things are.

Avro is an agent Provocateur with a passion. Much bigger complexes over the war then you (or me) appear to show at times. The responses are mostly in kind.

However, the Versailles treaty was a humilation in more ways then most british realize. It was not just the financial conditions and lost territories, it also had to do with some very odd plebiscits in the east, rape on a massive scale during the occupation in the Rhineland by the French. The fact that Germany agreed to the Armistice based on Wilsons 14 point plan which was utterly trashed later in the negotiations. The fact that all war guilt was pushed on Germany, despite the Kaiser actually trying to attempt demobilisation in his letters with the Russian Csar. There are fair treates, and there are treaties especially aimed and kick an opponent already on the ground. This behaviour was expected from the French, not from the british.
The Versailles treaty was the latter and though I do not approve of the Nazis, I actually DO understand why people voted for them back then, also in connection with the Great Depression.

Ok but even if the treaty was a humiliation did it justify war? and why exactly did the Polish get hammered on that basis?
In times of depression a massive drive toward civil engineering could work just as well as military development....there was another option.

Are you judging from todays moral POV, or the historical one? There is a huge difference there.

Not sure......just my POV

About bringing civilisation to other parts of the world....would you accept being swallowed by China? Or Germany? Despite them willing to develop your industries?

Depends how good their 'fire water is'

Still does not justify why german innovations back then and there defense warrents such comparisons. Germany has been an innovative area right throughout it's history, with the printing press or the automobile as some prominent examples.

I'm surprised you missed my point, the V2 was an innovation no? but solely for the purpouse of war, and this is a forum about a period of war.
any innovation outside of periods of conflict have not been particularily remarkeable by comparison to other nations, what I mean to say is that every developed nation have invented and innovated something it's not a capability unique to Germany but it is accepted Germany have been in the top of the list.

We also may have some cultural misunderstandings here. In Germany there is a lot of pride in achievements and knowledge and that is widely displayed. Lack of education or downplaying what you managed is rather frowned upon. That may be what you understand as "bragging".

Yes....to a degree, it's less vulgar to brag about admirable qualities like hard work, but modesty is practically a virtue in the UK.

That said, I never percieved or got the impression of "plucky undersdg" when it comes to the UK

Well during WWII thats exactly what Britain was.