Originally Posted by philip.ed (Post 198817)

I've ready many accounts from pilots who have said the same thing, too.

Originally Posted by Redwan (Post 198828)

Do you mean real pilots ?

Originally Posted by Redwan (Post 198837)

Its seems obvious that tracers are very helpfull when aiming at the ennemi. I'm surprised that it doesn't seem obvious for anywone ... who has played IL2.

Originally Posted by Splitter (Post 198841)

I'll have to go back and find it, but I do remember a report that some groups eliminated tracers completely and their effectiveness went up.

Think about it...on a longer deflection shot, tracers help. But when you a snuggled up on someone's six at close range, tracers don't matter at all. Flashes from hits tell you everything you need to know.

All AP and incendiary rounds would do more damage than replacing 20% of the ammo with less destructive tracer rounds.

Now I guess I have to go find the documents on groups eliminating tracers :)

Splitter

Originally Posted by philip.ed (Post 198817)

I disagree, and I tested this out in Il-2 by launching a mission against a lone (friendly) heinkel in Il-2 flying the Hurricane mark 1 and then the Spit Mark V using only the .303's. Consequently, the Hurricane would spit the tracer from all 8 guns, whereas the Spit would only be shooting it from 4 (so half).
I scored more hits with the spit than I did with the Hurri in a period of 15 seconds firing short bursts. The reason? I could see my target, and where my tracer was going! I know exactly what you mean, Swiss, but many pilots chose to limit their tracer to just one or 2 guns to give a clearer view of the target when firing (even burst firing with the 8-gun planes can be hard).
As with ammo, I agree; more destructive ammo, in ever sense, just compensates for pilot error (unless the pilot is skilled enough to know when to use it).

I'm not disagreeing with you entirely, but that's my experience from Il-2 and BoB2-WoV. I've ready many accounts from pilots who have said the same thing, too.

Originally Posted by Triggaaar (Post 198804)

Why would you need to know? If you want to know for training purposes, just set-up an off-line mission where you shoot at an enemy bomber that is unarmed, and keep practicing with different ammo mixes, and see how much damage you can do. Am I missing your point (if so, what is it)?