Official Fulqrum Publishing forum - Friday Official Update, July 27, 2012

Official Fulqrum Publishing forum (http://forum.fulqrumpublishing.com/index.php)

- IL-2 Sturmovik: Cliffs of Dover (http://forum.fulqrumpublishing.com/forumdisplay.php?f=189)

- - Friday Official Update, July 27, 2012 (http://forum.fulqrumpublishing.com/showthread.php?t=33471)

So this is what it's come to eh Blackdog? Be-littling gamers because they wan't a sim to work instead of becoming a developer themselves? I don't know about others, but I work for a living and barely have time to actually play my sims let alone learn C# scripting or start poking around for work arounds.

For the people that have done this....I applaud them for taking the time to try and find workarounds for this mess...but time isn't a luxury all of us have. If 1C was up front and marketed this as a "buy in Beta program" then you might have a better point. Telling us to be good little lemmings and just take it in the shorts for the $50 to $70 isn't gonna fly with everyone. People are frustrated...and have every right to be IMO.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fenrir (Post 449853)

Oh BRAVO.... :rolleyes:

People of your ilk have long lost the right to be 'treated like adults' as your above post so aptly demonstrates.

Has it ever occured to you that the programming crew might spend so many hours in a day trying to get stuff fixed that they might not relish the idea of coming in here and being haranged by obnoxious flaming little brats of the ilk that you so excellently typify. To know that you frustrations wll be compounded by whiny grabbing ignorants who'll villify you for your efforts because they can't generate enough brain power to look beyond their own selfish little desires?

I'd stay so damn far away it's not funny.

B6 is their spokes person, he was away for one damn day for reasons beyond his control. Sh1t happens, get over it.

And as for programming, No I'm not a programmer, but I've used enough html and flash codes over the years and had friends of mine who are try to explain coding that actually I damn well KNOW it CAN be that complicated. You are the one who sounds like he doesn't have a clue. Unless of course you have a brand new WW2 flight sim of amazing high fidelity flight dyamics, with your own home built game engine waiting in the wings?

No? i didn't think so. Just goes to show there are too many pretentious ignorant pricks around here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackdog_kt (Post 449877)

If people spent as much energy in the sim as they do in the forums

1) we would have a deeper knowledge of how things work in the sim, making it easier to see exactly why something else doesn't work

2) we would have compiled our own comprehensive, prioritised bug list and submitted it to 1c, making it much faster to correct them.

3) we would have workarounds for most of the things that don't work

4) armed with all the above, we would have tons of missions to enjoy (online and offline) because people would be able to work around the problems

You know, like Wolf does in his channel command mission that is hosted on ATAG. Or like some of us did in trying to give a proper battle of Britain feel to this sim, first by trying to make bombers workable and then by advocating certain priorities in specific gameplay fixes. Highly unpopular gameplay fixes but negligible in terms of work hours required (especially compared to some of the more popular features), which however have a tremendous effect on gameplay. You know, stuff like the LW bombers being able to aim their bombs in a sim about a battle where LW was bombing the UK. Or getting someone to copy-paste the working code from the He-111's gyrocompass to the non-working Ju88's gyrocompass. We've had to wait 18 months for that last one, not because the devs didn't know about it, but because too many people thought the tracers were not squiggly enough, or the grass was too green, or whatever else "highly important" feature that was shouted from the rooftops at various points in time and had to be appeased by taking full priority in the dev team's schedule :-P

Well, people like Wolf want things to work in the game and he made them work. Now he's got the developer's ear and is in direct communication with them about bug hunting and testing, because he sees things that the majority of users don't: FMB bugs, scripting issues, netcode problems, etc. Important stuff. In a similar fashion, in the "news from sukhoi.ru" thread i saw that they are fixing the bombsights too.

The sim will start feeling like battle of Britain instead of battle of the Dover-Calais strait, compared to that a delay of a few days or even a week or two is inconsequential to me. If they told me "we'll fix all known bugs in all aircraft systems but release the patch two weeks later" i'd say "sure, go for it", because:
- It's easier and totally unambiguous to get right, as opposed to the endless FM/DM debates. A switch is a switch and does a specific thing.
- It ups the realism and authenticity, giving us more to play with until everything else is ironed out.
- Even if the FMs are a bit dodgy still, it gives us aircraft that can function in their intended role.

Overall, the funny thing is that a few people in the community who just wanted the sim to work for themselves and did something to achieve it, will result in the sim getting fixed faster for everyone, including those who think we're wasting our time. Well, in a sense we are all wasting our time here, it's a hobby.

The difference is how much you (impersonal "you", in general) make the hobby work for you, because that's what differentiates between the "good" and "bad" kinds of wasted time. You put some time in, you get some knowledge out of it that helps you enjoy it more. Or you can just tell everybody else to hurry up in the forums, report the bugs for you, find the workarounds for you, host the servers for you, build the missions for you, etc etc. Well, if they thought like you, none of that would ever get done and your $50 would surely have been wasted. So either join them in their efforts or let them do their job for you in peace.
You might have paid money to maddox games, but you haven't paid any to all the community members that are helping the developer team fix your game, have you now? Well, we don't want money, we just want to be left to work in peace for a while :-P

A logical solution while waiting for the devs to complete this very complicated sim, and infinitely more constructive than infantile destructive forum trolling.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LOPAN (Post 449878)

And to say nothing about that this was priced as an AAA title (US$50).

Money is spent...most of you that are of age... and that does not appear to be many.... have whizzed away more than $50 on Beer, Cigs and other worthless junk...

Using the cost to make a point .....as a gripe point..... is just ridiculous

I would be willing to send many $50...to just go away

:cool:

Quote:

Originally Posted by MegOhm (Post 449890)

Money is spent...most of you that are of age... and that does not appear to be many.... have whizzed away more than $50 on Beer, Cigs and other worthless junk...

Using the cost to make a point .....as a gripe point..... is just ridiculous

I would be willing to send many $50...to just go away

:cool:

Ridiculous? Then why do you think people are willing to pay more for a top product and less for a standard/mediocre product? That's just how our society works. Supply and demand, you know?

If you a buy a brand new ultra-modern computer for $1500 and it wouldn't turn on because something inside it is f*cked up you couldn't complain about it. Because there are many ultra-cheap unreliable $50 computers that get broken easily and you cannot use the costs to make a gripe point. Is that your logic?

Most have gotten their $50.00 worth of b!tching, though.... I'd venture to say that some have even got their $1500.00 worth of b!tching (on both sides of the CoD coin).

The $50.00 issue may be important to some, but the amount of whining and insulting that has gone on is way more than would happen for the same $50.00 if this was not in some anonymous forum and instead was a real life person to person transaction.

I know that if someone was to be outside my business hurling insults and slander, there would only be a certain amount of time that my patience would stop me from seeking due course of action - if not by police, then a good kick in the ass to the offender. Unless some here seek bar fights on a regular basis, I doubt the crap spewn would be casually thrown around in a bar where one's actions could be called into account.

$50.00 doesn't give license to be a horses patute. I've witnessed this sort of behaviour from both camps.

Even the CFS3 fiasco didn't attract the same carry-ons which go on here

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fenrir (Post 449853)

you are not, but I am a programmer, and even more, a game designer and a game producer, and I've worked on developing games and software for the last 10 years, from MMORPGs to virtual operating systems for ARM tablets.

imagine that I dare to say I know more about game developing than you, and your friend, and another 10 like you both together!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolf_Rider (Post 449897)

Even the CFS3 fiasco didn't attract the same carry-ons which go on here

because no one really loved the bug-pit that CFS2 was, or the arogant bastards from M$.

you can not hate without loving first.

and about the matter at hand.. do you imagine how ridiculous their excuse sounds? do you imagine M$, or Nlizzard, or Activision, or Take2, or Electronic Arts, or Ubisoft, or any other western game developer announcing a conferece on a date, to then only post on their forums that their CEO is on a trip, and the conferece announcer got sick for a day or two, so they won't have any conference at all.. while the conference room is still stuffed up with press reprezentatives waiting for the answer..

norhing short of simply ridiculous! if your brain does see that as a valid, mature and acceptable excuse, I would say that you have a high fever at least..

I'm fed up with this kind of behavior and excuses! I understand their difficult situation, lack of good programmers and project managers, and the fact that a patch might need a long time to be coded, but I do not want to be treated like a mental disordered brain dead child in the mean time!

People are complaining because the creator of the product they've purchased is giving them motives.

They are not complaining about futile issues, like the appearance of the trees or because they didn't like the ending (like in Mass Effect 3).

Instead, they are complaining because they've purchased (including myself) a crude and broken product (apparently in alpha stage) for an AAA price. And to this day (9 months after the last patch), the creators have progressed very little to change this aspect.

and all of you hypocrites telling the rest that 50 euro are nothing (and actually to all Il2 CoD community), I would love to see you act accordingly: when BoM is out, why won't you buy 10, or at least 5, copies, as those 50 euro are nothing to you, thus doing many goods to this sim:
- multiply MG's income by 5 or 10
- rise up the number of sold copies by 5 or 10, making the publishers present a new interest to this genre
- attract new people to WWII flight sim genre by giving away the extra copies trough unknown gamers not playing this kind of game

there you go! let's see how you are responding to this proposal, which actually would be the best way to support this game series and genre..

vote with your money, or forever shut up about those "insignifiant" 50s!!!