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JG52Krupi 07-27-2011 08:51 AM

Come on Sternjaeger II, I have searched for your name and there are 152 of you currently registered on this board, stop skewing the poll! Why would anyone want an update!!! ;)

robtek 07-27-2011 09:05 AM

The question is: why wouldn't anyone like a update?

Answer : everybody would like a update.

I could have told you that without any poll!

Does everybody need a update?

No! Only a quite loud minority seems to be unable to endure the waiting time.

Sternjaeger II 07-27-2011 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JG52Krupi (Post 315527)
Come on Sternjaeger II, I have searched for your name and there are 152 of you currently registered on this board, stop skewing the poll! Why would anyone want an update!!! ;)

*read with a Stewie Griffin voice*
Blast! You ruined my cunning plan! :mrgreen:

Sternjaeger II 07-27-2011 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robtek (Post 315533)
The question is: why wouldn't anyone like a update?

Answer : everybody would like a update.

I could have told you that without any poll!

Does everybody need a update?

No! Only a quite loud minority seems to be unable to endure the waiting time.

some people (or shall I say, most of the people that voted in this post?), probably don't care too much for posting, arguing and fighting, all they care for is... a regular and adequate update.

We were given the option to use polls, we are doing it. Post a poll yourself (possibly a serious one, unlike some other trolls recently did) and I'll be happy to vote and express my opinion.

Is it so very hard to understand? :confused:

bongodriver 07-27-2011 09:28 AM

Regular= constant frequency.....this could mean once every year and it would be regular, by this token the more than once a month we seem to be getting is by definition better than 'regular'.....is it not?

want < need.....need is greater than want, we all 'want', we don't need.

these are facts so please don't go down the 'you studid fanboi troll' route in response, I am not here for the argument, these are just the points that make me stand firm by my oppinions on this topic.

Tree_UK 07-27-2011 09:45 AM

The bottom line is this, it is more than clear that the mass majority of members who actively use this forum are currently dissatisfied with the communication we are getting.
How Luthier wishes to deal with this is up to him, however if he is a smart business man then I would imagine that he will address it, in an odd way he already has tried to placate us by telling us there will be a community manager, this of course turned out to be just rhetoric which to some extent is on par with most of Luthier's recent statements. Actions speak louder than words and hopefully Luthier will see that his current customer support is very much lacking and he needs to go back to the basic principle of business in that the 'customer is always right'.

bongodriver 07-27-2011 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tree_UK (Post 315556)
The bottom line is this, it is more than clear that the mass majority of members who actively use this forum are currently dissatisfied with the communication we are getting.
How Luthier wishes to deal with this is up to him, however if he is a smart business man then I would imagine that he will address it, in an odd way he already has tried to placate us by telling us there will be a community manager, this of course turned out to be just rhetoric which to some extent is on par with most of Luthier's recent statements. Actions speak louder than words and hopefully Luthier will see that his current customer support is very much lacking and he needs to go back to the basic principle of business in that the 'customer is always right'.

OK but which of his customers are 'right' when they seem to have opposing views?

MadTommy 07-27-2011 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by furbs (Post 315520)
Tommy, did you mean this....

Rabble = "complaints from paying customers , that i just dont happen to agree with, but are of course allowed to express their views as long as they comply with forum rules"

:)

No i meant:

Rabble = a disorderly crowd; mob

I agree with a lot the rabble's basic sentiments.. i just get tired of many of them expressing the same sentiment over and over again in every thread, effectively spamming the forums and derailing any other discussion.

Sternjaeger II 07-27-2011 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bongodriver (Post 315548)
Regular= constant frequency.....this could mean once every year and it would be regular, by this token the more than once a month we seem to be getting is by definition better than 'regular'.....is it not?

want < need.....need is greater than want, we all 'want', we don't need.

these are facts so please don't go down the 'you studid fanboi troll' route in response, I am not here for the argument, these are just the points that make me stand firm by my oppinions on this topic.

bongo, let's not play this game please, you know what I mean with regular frequency. There's a balance between "hey, no news yet, but.." and "yeah, woreva man.." :rolleyes:

I would like (as a customer and fan), don't want or need. Can't help but feeling sympathy for people that are upset because they bought a game that was sold to them as complete and found it was an alpha though..

Tree_UK 07-27-2011 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bongodriver (Post 315558)
OK but which of his customers are 'right' when they seem to have opposing views?

Well if you look at the poll the mass majority are right in saying they are dissatisfied.

bongodriver 07-27-2011 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tree_UK (Post 315564)
Well if you look at the poll the mass majority are right in saying they are dissatisfied.

the poll says nothing of dissatisfaction, it just says we want updates.

Tree_UK 07-27-2011 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bongodriver (Post 315566)
the poll says nothing of dissatisfaction, it just says we want updates.

I think your argument is becoming very trivial now Bongo, you have resulted to a play on words. So what does the poll tell you exactly?

Does it tell you that 155 members are currently very happy?
Or does it suggest that 155 members are dissastisfied with the current communication?

bongodriver 07-27-2011 10:13 AM

it doesn't tell me anything, it just confirms my original statement that it's obvious everybody will want updates.


all good and well saying my argument is trivial......to you, that just happens to be my feelings on this topic.

JG52Krupi 07-27-2011 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bongodriver (Post 315574)
it doesn't tell me anything, it just confirms my original statement that it's obvious everybody will want updates.


all good and well saying my argument is trivial......to you, that just happens to be my feelings on this topic.

Everyone wants updates... Surely that means they are dissatisfied with the lack of communication atm.

Tree_UK 07-27-2011 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bongodriver (Post 315574)
it doesn't tell me anything, it just confirms my original statement that it's obvious everybody will want updates.


all good and well saying my argument is trivial......to you, that just happens to be my feelings on this topic.

Im fine with that Bongo, you are very much entitled to your opinion, and i would be most dissappointed if you felt that your opinion didn't matter because im sure it does.

See you in the pub. :grin:

bongodriver 07-27-2011 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JG52Krupi (Post 315579)
Everyone wants updates... Surely that means they are dissatisfied with the lack of communication atm.

simply no....to ambiguous, everybody wants updates....who wouldn't....really despite some on the poll saying not, why didn't the poll say speciffically I'm dissatisfied with the communication?

does wanting something make you dissatisfied in life?

Tree_UK 07-27-2011 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bongodriver (Post 315585)
simply no....to ambiguous, everybody wants updates....who wouldn't....really despite some on the poll saying not, why didn't the poll say speciffically I'm dissatisfied with the communication?

does wanting something make you dissatisfied in life?

We already did that in the form of a petition the result was more than convincing, hence its sudden removal.

bongodriver 07-27-2011 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tree_UK (Post 315592)
We already did that in the form of a petition the result was more than convincing hence its sudden removal.

I must have missed it....was away las week, in Moscow of all places....maybe I should have given Luthier a visit.

Tree_UK 07-27-2011 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bongodriver (Post 315594)
I must have missed it....was away las week, in Moscow of all places....maybe I should have given Luthier a visit.

lol, that would of been interesting :grin:

David Hayward 07-27-2011 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tree_UK (Post 315592)
We already did that in the form of a petition the result was more than convincing, hence its sudden removal.

Actually, the fact that it was removed does not indicate that it was convincing. If it had been convincing you would have got an update. Instead, the dev team is mocking you.

Tree_UK 07-27-2011 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Hayward (Post 315682)
Actually, the fact that it was removed does not indicate that it was convincing. If it had been convincing you would have got an update. Instead, the dev team is mocking you.

David, you are in a minority, I suspect that even outside this forum you have spent most of your life in this category.

David Hayward 07-27-2011 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tree_UK (Post 315697)
David, you are in a minority, I suspect that even outside this forum you have spent most of your life in this category.

I'm relatively certain that whether I am in the minority is completely irrelevant to the issue. The simple fact is that if your poll was as convincing as you seem to think it was, you would have got a progress report. That's what happens when you do something convincing. You get someone to do something that they would not do previous to your actions. Said progress report did not occur. Thusly, your poll was not as convincing as you seem to think it was.

At least that's according to my understanding of the definition of convincing. Perhaps you have a different definition?

JG52Uther 07-27-2011 02:15 PM

Tree don't feed the troll.

furbs 07-27-2011 02:56 PM

Maybe the poll being removed after just a hour and having over 80 people agree with it proves it was having a very big effect here, why else would it be removed?

Pudfark 07-27-2011 03:38 PM

I am beginning to think?
The dog ate Luthiers home work...

And the incomplete grade he received?
Is having trouble making it home...

Some folks say he got lost?
Others say it appears a bit dodgy?

Luthier says: "................................................. ...................."

And there, you have it.....

"No answer is an answer"....and it isn't a good one...for anybody.

addman 07-27-2011 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JG52Uther (Post 315706)
Tree don't feed the troll.

Don't you mean, don't let the trolls feed the trolls?;)

furbs 07-27-2011 03:53 PM

Maybe we will get a update this Friday?

catito14 07-27-2011 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by furbs (Post 315738)
Maybe we will get a update this Friday?

It´s the "never ending" story ... :rolleyes:

furbs 07-27-2011 04:22 PM

quite true!

Robert 07-27-2011 05:54 PM

The polls still up. It has 170 yeahs. 29 nays, and 9 I'm not sures. I just voted the third option to see if it still tallys, and it does.

Robert 07-27-2011 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JG52Krupi (Post 315579)
Everyone wants updates... Surely that means they are dissatisfied with the lack of communication atm.


And yet there have been numerous posts stating categorically just the opposite. They want more information but that doesn't mean they're unsatisfied. The poll (no matter how well meaning) is flawed as it doesn't clearly explain the intention of the voters.

von Pilsner 07-27-2011 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert (Post 315798)
The poll (no matter how well meaning) is flawed as it doesn't clearly explain the intention of the voters.

True for nearly every internet forum poll ever created... :D

Sternjaeger II 07-27-2011 06:20 PM

Oh for the love of bananas Robert.. It does explain things very easily,you are nitpicking! You dont agree? Stop sounding like a broken record and get yr own poll!

Robert 07-27-2011 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sternjaeger II (Post 315805)
Oh for the love of bananas Robert.. It does explain things very easily,you are nitpicking! You dont agree? Stop sounding like a broken record and get yr own poll!



What? LOL. Like you haven't spammed this god forsaken place? Puh-leez! I am NOT nit picking. There is a huge difference between how I interpret the poll (and you confirmed yesterday to me) and what is being portrayed from the poll results. Unless I REALLY misunderstood your intention and explanation of your precious poll - you lied to me..... and at this point I don't really care any more.



I won't comment again in your precious poll.

Langnasen 07-27-2011 09:03 PM

Just over 200 people have responded to this since yesterday? Only that number? I guess that says all that needs to be said about the failure of this game.

Dano 07-27-2011 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Langnasen (Post 315879)
Just over 200 people have responded to this since yesterday? Only that number? I guess that says all that needs to be said about the failure of this game.

Not everybody uses forums, in fact last time I looked at any sort of stats based on them we forumites were a definite minority.

Blackdog_kt 07-27-2011 11:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tree_UK (Post 315483)
Blackdog

Would you like to be informed in a regular and effective way on patch progress

How can that be misleading, yes or no?? very simple really, the reason the question is being asked is because at present we are not being informed, so i fail to see how the poll is some kind trap for unsuspecting members.

Blackdog - another long post, I dont speak for anyone other than myself its just that as you can see 145 people currently share my view and only 14 share yours, that makes you part of a minority, I cant help that it is what it is. Also the poill does not ask for 'weekly' updates as you suggested it clearly ask for regular.

Lastly, regarding my predictions I see you have jumped on the same bandwagon as others suggesting I predicted eveything, that is wrong if you bothered to research this particular attack on me by reading my old posts you would see I concentrated my predictions in certain key areas, Im dissappointed that you have failed to gather some factual evidence, I had this discussion recently and challenged two people to look at my old posts, they failed to respond, perhaps your the guy to finally expose me?? Good luck.

I don't have the time to look through your posts, if you want to use previous posts to make a point keep bookmarks and link them for me, i'll be happy to reconsider. Until then, i'm not keen on doing your work for you, i have to type another long post of my own ;-)


On the actual topic of the thread, this:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert (Post 315798)
And yet there have been numerous posts stating categorically just the opposite. They want more information but that doesn't mean they're unsatisfied. The poll (no matter how well meaning) is flawed as it doesn't clearly explain the intention of the voters.

I want updates. I didn't vote for updates. Why? Because the kind and frequency of updates i want is not specified and my vote will be twisted into meaning something it's not meant to. This is not Sternjaeger's fault (i guess he made an honest mistake and just forgot that everything gets dissected down to quarks in this forum :-P ) and i'm not calling him biased.

I'm just saying that if i vote for updates, based on previous interactions with certain members of this board i expect my vote to receive a biased interpretation contrary to the one it has, so i choose not to give them ammunition.

Well, this turned out to be a short post after all :cool:

Sternjaeger II 07-28-2011 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert (Post 315842)
What? LOL. Like you haven't spammed this god forsaken place? Puh-leez! I am NOT nit picking. There is a huge difference between how I interpret the poll (and you confirmed yesterday to me) and what is being portrayed from the poll results. Unless I REALLY misunderstood your intention and explanation of your precious poll - you lied to me..... and at this point I don't really care any more.



I won't comment again in your precious poll.

Well I'm sorry, but I, the OP, haven't given any interpretation. I just asked a simple question and now I'm sitting here wondering I should get a lawyer to check the form of what I write before posting it, so I don't come out in manners or forms that can be misinterpreted..

We talked about it, you expressed your opinion, you explained why you voted what, fine, let's move on, no political/social/evil agendas will use this poll for any hidden purpose, it was just meant to check on the general mood of people and see whether it was just a bunch of us that wanted regular and serious updates or not. Turns out some people don't find it necessary, so there you go..

I'm sorry but being processed in that manner regularly despite my explanations is really annoying, all in all it's just another poll nobody will listen to.

Sternjaeger II 07-28-2011 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackdog_kt (Post 315927)
I want updates. I didn't vote for updates. Why? Because the kind and frequency of updates i want is not specified and my vote will be twisted into meaning something it's not meant to. This is not Sternjaeger's fault (i guess he made an honest mistake and just forgot that everything gets dissected down to quarks in this forum :-P ) and i'm not calling him biased.

I'm just saying that if i vote for updates, based on previous interactions with certain members of this board i expect my vote to receive a biased interpretation contrary to the one it has, so i choose not to give them ammunition.

Well, this turned out to be a short post after all :cool:

Sorry Blackdog but twisted by who? As I said to Robert, did we really get to the stage where we have to ponder every word so much?! Come on guys...

..and yeah, probably your shortest post? ;)

Robert 07-28-2011 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sternjaeger II (Post 316029)
Well I'm sorry, but I, the OP, haven't given any interpretation. I just asked a simple question and now I'm sitting here wondering I should get a lawyer to check the form of what I write before posting it, so I don't come out in manners or forms that can be misinterpreted..

We talked about it, you expressed your opinion, you explained why you voted what, fine, let's move on, no political/social/evil agendas will use this poll for any hidden purpose, it was just meant to check on the general mood of people and see whether it was just a bunch of us that wanted regular and serious updates or not. Turns out some people don't find it necessary, so there you go..

I'm sorry but being processed in that manner regularly despite my explanations is really annoying, all in all it's just another poll nobody will listen to.


It's all good Sternjaeger. For my part I apologize. I'm not trying to be a dink, and I think you know that. I just got caught up in the "Storm of War", if you will.

All of our postings aren't going to get this game into the condition we all want any faster. Waiting (as Tom Petty says) is the hardest part.

Sternjaeger II 07-28-2011 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert (Post 316032)
It's all good Sternjaeger. For my part I apologize. I'm not trying to be a dink, and I think you know that. I just got caught up in the "Storm of War", if you will.

All of our postings aren't going to get this game into the condition we all want any faster. Waiting (as Tom Petty says) is the hardest part.

I know you aren't man.

And Tom Petty is right, but it'd be less hard with regular updates ;)

furbs 07-28-2011 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert (Post 316032)
It's all good Sternjaeger. For my part I apologize. I'm not trying to be a dink, and I think you know that. I just got caught up in the "Storm of War", if you will.

All of our postings aren't going to get this game into the condition we all want any faster. Waiting (as Tom Petty says) is the hardest part.


Were all getting pretty burned out on here.(i know iam)

speculum jockey 07-28-2011 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by furbs (Post 316043)
Were all getting pretty burned out on here.(i know iam)

A lot of it is the total lack of content in this game. Single Player is pretty much limited to Quick Missions and Multiplayer is . . . well I don't need to say any more.

That last update by Luthier was pretty much a "F-U" to the community who were wondering if they were going to have a playable game in the next year. As for him saying, "everything is great, the company is doing great!" What else is he going to say? Even if they were ripping out the copper wiring and selling all their office supplies on eBay he'd still say the same thing.

Sternjaeger II 07-28-2011 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by speculum jockey (Post 316125)
A lot of it is the total lack of content in this game. Single Player is pretty much limited to Quick Missions and Multiplayer is . . . well I don't need to say any more.

That last update by Luthier was pretty much a "F-U" to the community who were wondering if they were going to have a playable game in the next year. As for him saying, "everything is great, the company is doing great!" What else is he going to say? Even if they were ripping out the copper wiring and selling all their office supplies on eBay he'd still say the same thing.

lol :mrgreen:

SJ, I always wanted to ask you: is that what you do for a living? (the speculum thing, not ripping offices bare and selling everything ;) ).

Sternjaeger II 08-01-2011 07:37 AM

Bump - would like to see more votes going into this biased poll :mrgreen:

Tree_UK 08-01-2011 11:08 AM

Well the poll as proved one thing for sure in that it really doesn't matter what luthiers customers think or want because he really doesn't care a hoot.

yellonet 08-01-2011 11:16 AM

Wow, that's some biased poll...

Feathered_IV 08-01-2011 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by furbs (Post 316043)
Were all getting pretty burned out on here.(i know iam)

Same here. Not sure if I'm very interested in supporting further Maddox Games products, now that all the original members seem to have left.

To use a musical metaphor, it's a bit like being a fan of the band, Jefferson Airplane. They were truly great once, but out of loyalty alone should you continue to buy the albums of Jefferson Starship?

David Hayward 08-01-2011 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tree_UK (Post 317776)
Well the poll as proved one thing for sure in that it really doesn't matter what luthiers customers think or want because he really doesn't care a hoot.

It's even worse than that. He is mocking you.

furbs 08-01-2011 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Hayward (Post 317807)
It's even worse than that. He is mocking you.


http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/180...olicerespe.jpg
By furbs9999 at 2011-08-01

albx 08-01-2011 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Hayward (Post 317807)
It's even worse than that. He is mocking you.

reported

David Hayward 08-01-2011 01:29 PM

Sorry, I just think it's funny that the game's dev team is now mocking you. Is it against forum rules to agree with the dev team?

furbs 08-01-2011 01:30 PM

Lets see what the mods say about that.

nearmiss 08-01-2011 01:57 PM

These threads always turn into name calling and personal attacks.


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