it is pure and simple, but some seem to have a problem with it's simplicity, they need a few ifs and buts thrown in with a liberal sprinkle of excuses and masses of denial.

Oh really and when the Nazis would have won, who would be there to say that they are the bad ones? Know what i mean?

Some horrible posts here.

Then:

Personally I never understood the "being proud to be XY" or "being proud of my country's past" etc.

What I'd like to say: I am proud of

- having done well at university

- having success x and y in my job

- being the best in this and that.

But the reason of being proud (or the opposite being ashamed) of something that I did have no part in and could not have had because I am too young for it eludes me completely. How can one be proud or ashamed of the deeds of somebody else? One may be grateful though ...

I do understand that one loves his country and wants the best for it but this has nothing to do with proudness or shamefulness for something long in the past.

This as a side note.

I wished some people just could take a few steps back and look at things from a distance.

Then we could have a civilized discussion here without bitching around ...

thats really just a selfish pride, but being proud of the deeds of your forebears who fought for a noble cause seems just fine to me.

Who cares? Being the only one left to write the propaganda doesn't make you right.

Yeah we actually already understood the bizarre logic, may as well have let the Germans have their way eh? nobody would be the wiser because nobody would be alive who had anything different to say.

strange.

selfishness = thinking of yourself above others, akin to nacissism etc

appreciating the actions of another is not selfish.......what's so strange

Of course you don't know, but first of all it was not about regaining the whole French Nation, it was about Alsace Lorraine. I don't know how many wars have been fought between France and Germany about it.

Boy you really dont get it!